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Sacred 2's Most Useful and Most Useless Skills


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it's been awhile since the release of Sacred 2 and with the impending release of the experience for pc players, I have to wonder if new skills that are accessible to all characters are going to be introduced.

if so and we aren't getting any new slots for skills[10 max], then we'll have to rid ourselves of some to make room for the new. of course this is all speculation as I have NO support to back up whether or not we'll be getting new skills. what we can conjecture on, however, is the usefulness and uselessness of certain skills.

 

I won't be going into character specific skills as there is no way to gauge their effectiveness[in fact, I would posit that ALL character specific skills are CRUCIAL], though we can dismiss certain defensive, offensive and general skills as everyone can use them.

 

so to start off, I will list my 3 absolute MUST have skills...no matter the build/character

 

01. armor lore- lowers armor malus for all types, but especially the heavier pieces. allows for the use of higher level armor without a speed penalty. scaling unlockables include casting speed, defensive value, attack value[?], +existing armor type; mastery includes all channel dm, -detrimental magic effects. an important skill for all characters in that it reduces regen penalties allowing for faster use of Combat Arts/more rune consumption. useful for casters on weapons such as tinwora's curse[casting speed]. all channel dm granted at mastery. what else could you want?

 

02. combat discipline- lowers regen times of all Combat Arts in combo by 10%. mastery lowers regen by 20%. increases the damage of all spell Combat Arts by a flat amount. increases the damage of all weapon based Combat Arts by their ca bonus. allows for 3-4 ca combos. this is THE premier skill to enhance damage output. it doesn't matter what character you play; this skill will help you kill faster and allows for more ingenious combos, such as utility or timered buff combos.

 

03. concentration- lowers regen times per skill point and allows the use of two buffs. at mastery, allows the use of 3 buffs. now, not all characters use more than one buff, but usually characters with a single aspect will be left wanting an extra skill or two due to not requiring another focus/lore. concentration helps all characters by lowering regen times even if only one buff is being used.

 

 

and now for the 3 most useless skills[in my opinion]

 

01. divine devotion- allows for more frequent use of god spell. increases the level of god spell[undocumented in-game] therefore, effectiveness of god spell. however, is limited to the usefulness of the god spell. MOST god spells are not very useful to begin with. I don't believe that the sakkara demon grants you experience when it kills monsters. slowing everything down all the time with lumen makes Area of Effect killing painful.

 

02. speed lore- increases run speed, attack and defense values by %. mastery unlocks include a 9% bonus to run speed and 135% bonus to atk/def values. 9% at mastery is a joke and a travesty in my eyes. at level 5, you can shop for gear[without bargaining, even] with run speed in the 10%'s in silver. at level 200 gear, you can find run speed in the 30%'s. seeing as how run speed is capped at 150% in generally most situations, choosing this skill for something that can be replaced by gear THREEFOLD is saddening. the atk/def value only benefits weapon based characters, leaving spell casters to benefit from def value only. chance to evade eclipses the bonus def value provides.

 

03. riding- all benefits gained ONLY when mounted- faster run speed, riding unlockables[horse only], increases horse ca damage. lowers regen times while mounted on a horse. this skill use only useful if you are mounted and on top of that, only truly useful if you ride a horse. it does not affect ca times when on a non horse[?]. unless you plan on making a horse only character[no character specific Combat Arts/buffs while mounted on a horse], you will be suffering big time. also keep in mind that most bosses are in caves, where mounts are not allowed, so your true effectiveness as a character is diminished in the most crucial times.

 

now, if they were replacing existing skills to make room for new ones, I would throw these three right out the window without hesitation. unless they add some unlockables/other benefits to using these skills, I don't see any reason why anyone would even want to touch these.

 

well...let the discussion begin- what are your 3 must haves and 3 don't wants?

keep in mind it's hard to have a varied discussion on skills because if you choose a skill that only 5/6 characters can take, it makes the discussion invalid as 1/6 cannot choose it. there are few all character skills...

 

or you could choose to discuss 5/6 or even 4/6 skills if you feel inclined. if I weren't so restrictive myself, I would throw blacksmith and bargaining into the must haves and magic staffs[should be staves anyway, bad on ascaron for the typo, unless it's vernacular] should be placed in the don't wants.

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Nice topic. I think I'd agree with most of your must haves, except maybe for Concentration. When I was running my Shadow Warrior horseback, I actually opted out of using Concentration becuase it would have been a second tier choice, and I wanted all the def I could muster into the build. I've always wondered about that choice, but then again, it would have only been for the horse Combat Arts...then again...that's the only reason we'd make a horse build right ^^

 

I'm thinking that I would opt again out of Concentration for the build and instead focus some on the regen per hit, which Schot has had some success with on his builds, and could help with the horse Combat Arts. Course, time seems to be always scant, but I feel like there's things about the mounted horse builds that I didn't yet discover, so I may indeed try it out and see where it goes.

 

Pony actually has created a very successful Horse Mounted build that is galloping through the servers as we speak. He, like me, lol, also opted out of using Concentration, as when we both discussed it, we felt that the extra choice we would have to take, especially as them being CA Skill choices would have crippled our build instead of enhancing it.

 

For mainstream builds, Concentration is definitely a keeper... for the exotics, like a Mounted, there are probably other options, and who knows what else can be done with that interesting little regen her hit mod ^^

 

Riding is also absolutely necessary for a Horse Mounted Build. If you've chosen to "take up the reigns" so to speak and see if the patience is there to stick it out with a horse build, you, of course, have to build in what's best... not choosing Riding once along this path is certain death. So again, for a mainstream build, I would think it would not offer as many benefits to a build as perhaps other choices on the palette. But for a Horse Mounted Build, it is integral, in fact, crucial for us to have it for the health points and Combat Arts we need to round up mobs well.

 

Regarding having to get off the mount and then go on foot versus certain bosses that don't allow mounts, at this point we would be on par with CA builds regarding HP bonuses... But while the CA builds would have their Combat Arts, the Non CA Builds (Mounted Horse) would have a huge number of points placed within their left click attacks via either strength or dexterity. Unless someone has tried a horse build, and actually set up points to run in all the other choices offered us rather than ca focuses and lores, it's hard to realize how much of a difference it can make to damage via bosses.

 

In fact, I have never noticed any decrease in kill speed for a non ca build versus a Ca build... yeah the CA build is flashier, but the non ca build has a plethora of other elements like solid hp, defense and hitting via this new distribution of points into his weapon lore , tactics etc...that I'm almost thinking they could be balanced out versus each other, especially with the resources us, as players now in this part of the game's progress have, eg. Bargaining networks, Clans, Multi Accounts... list goes on.

 

Speed Lore...hmmm, well, my jury's out on that. I'll be honest and say that the one time when I did pick it I was disapointed. I picked it because I thought it would help with my Mounted Build's CTH...but after seeing that I could socket better...ONLY because of my bargaining network...I scrapped the build and restarted.

 

Thing is...if I didn't have that bargaining network...would that skill choice have had benefits? I mean, if I didn't have bargaining network and/or my friends in the clan...how would I have found all the sweet crazy wild Anti Evasion Rings that almost guaranteed me a hit every time?

 

As well, there is a poster in the SIF now who has taken a toon to Speed Lore Mastery, and has gotten benefits which they are convinced were useful. If Speed Lore is helping with the CTH and Defense... would we not then, as good players, re-balance to profit from the opportunity?

 

Gosh, LOL...sorry for the long post...this is why I try to stay away from the meaty topics like this, I get lost in them start to type, and before I know it the sun's gone.

 

Oh well.

 

I hope some other readers can get at least a lick of enjoyment from the words, maybe as much as I had when I wrote them.

 

Thanks for the topic soldats.

 

 

:)

 

gogo

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which brings up a question, does combat d increase the damage/reduce regen times of horse Combat Arts? or is it character Combat Arts only?

 

I'm quite curious...

 

as for horse builds, I would go even further to say that riding is NECESSARY as much as any other character specific aspect. because that is the livelihood of your build, it is necessary.

 

but for the majority of players, I would say that riding would not be in the top shelf of skills.

 

and I agree again with certain general skills...without them, some characters would be inefficient...or even worse, some builds could not exist/emerge without superior gear/knowledge gained from having superior gear

 

I wish that more of the skills had been accessible to ALL characters, as it would have widely affected creativity. for instance, I don't understand why combat r. cannot be had by a high elf when they clearly gave her a melee ca. or even worse, ancient magic is not available to tg's and seraphim's, some of which are heavy spell casters, yet most of their spells only call from 1 or 2 native elements, meaning that certain minibosses are untouchable. I guess that last part was a gripe, but I'm trying to figure out why ascaron designed characters with 2/3 aspects devoted to spell casting and did not give them ancient magic....

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some builds could not exist/emerge without superior gear/knowledge gained from having superior gear

 

Well said.

 

I completely agree and like your tack on that.

 

Us having so many resources now in the twilight of this game comes, most probably, because we've seen what builds are capable of when being specced with the best.

 

Because we see range of gaming abilities when gifted by the best equipment, it gives us inspiration...and inspiration can take us out of the mainstream and have us tinker with the exotics. Your work with damage mitigation could be example of this. The ability to create that kind of a build I would definitely call advanced. Not only because of the knowledge of mechanics it commands, as well as having socketing down to an art, unless a player is altering files for an SP game, they would have a very difficult time of re-creating your work without bargainers or friends already set up, or a horde of equipment canvassed from multi-distillations of pre-run efforts.

 

If I were to cast out some conjecture regarding why Ascaron set up the skills the way they did, it would be because they wanted to create hard limits for what each character could do or go. Of course, these limits can sometimes be manipulated by having spectacular equipment or knowing in advance what kind of interplay or synergy will exist at higher levels...and it also gives each class some character perhaps.

 

We are defined as much by what we cannot do as what we can do.

 

:)

 

gogo

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Great idea for a topic, Soldats.

 

3 most useful skills in my opinion:

 

1. Armor lore - you said it. No build can survive without it. Even a cloaked SW may be killed if he's discovered by the mobs without it - and I personally guarantee (having a level 146 Buffer SW based on Veil) that a player WILL decloak by his/hers own mistake, and then he/she's toast if the mobs turn at the char straight away - which they do 75% of the time :)

 

2. Constitution - +HP, +HP regen rate. This skill is the pinnacle of pretty much every build and is usually mastered by level 75 by all chars that have it, especially in HC. More HP means you will survive awhile longer, and its usefulness is beyond any doubt.

 

3. Toughness - damage mitigation, additional armor. This skill is vastly underrated, but in my eyes, it's wickedly powerful when combined with the previous two - armor lore and constitution. Those 3 defensive skills alone will make a build last till level 200 in HC. Granted, the HE and the Dryad don't get it, but still, I would pick it anytime without a doubt.

 

The three most useless skills:

 

1. Divine devotion - yes, nothing good in it. At level 200 it reduces the god spell regen time from 1200 (initial) to about 180 seconds (if my math is correct). Wicked. I'm supposed to wait 3 minutes to use it again?! And what do I do in the meantime, scratch my butt and put fingers in my nose? Thanks but no thanks :)

 

2. Alchemy - don't get me wrong, it's a great skill. However, it is only the Dryad that can utilize it properly, since it's a second tier skill to everyone else. This means you have to pick 1 general skill in order to get access to this one and its sweet properties. How many chars who would like to get to 200 in HC without much trouble will deprive themselves of 2 skills to get alchemy? Few to none, I'd say.

 

3. Enhanced perception - yeah, you heard me. I know some people will laugh at me for saying this - especially because I was the fervent supporter of this skill like 4-5 months ago. It improves the chance to find valuables, the chance to spot hiding places, the loot from chests, etc. However, my experience in this game has unequivocally shown that if you have to rely on this skill to get your equipment, you're in big trouble. Set and unique items drop from bosses and mini-bosses even without any chance to find valuables, provided you're persistent enough and have a good enough char to beat them up.

 

Since we are talking about the 3 best/worst skills, I can't add more, but I'd really like to share my so-called "Whenever in doubt, pick this" list:

1. Armor lore

2. Constitution

3. Toughness

4. Bargaining - without a proper bargainer, you're leaving your life into fate's hands. You may get a good drop that will make a bargainer look stupid - but you may not. Besides, I'd rather spend 30 mins shopping than 30 hours killing stuff hoping for a favorable rare drop :)

5. Combat Discipline

6. Concentration

 

Of course, not all builds allow for all of them, but these are the skills that comprise most of my builds and I would go for them whenever I am in doubt asto which skill to pick :)

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Riding and Combat Discipline: Damage Yes, Regeneration-Time No. Riding CA can't be put in combinations( 2.40).

Horse Combat Arts are Spells, so ancient magic, intelligence, ... boost their damage. The regeneration time on horse Combat Arts are bugged still in 2.43.

 

Alchemy: I know I am crazy, but since I am sure that I am not a zombie and therefore living: At least one person played a build into hardcore niob (Lvl161) which is heavily using alchemy. Weaponless magic coup elf, using alchemy to get the hit chance versus bosses.

This character has no combat discipline because I play her pure melee, without nimbus or meteors as close combat control spells. As a melee elf she can't use toughness.

 

My Dryad staff/shield-horse rider used alchemy to unlock riding. Acute Mind used to boost horse Combat Arts and staff damage. Alchemy used to unlock riding. Having Alchemy I didn't take concentration, just as Gogo. Rider builds are something different. My daughters call this build the Pferdeflüsterin (female horse-whisperer) because the dryad has to unmount , start Acute Mind, mount and then can kill whole group with a charge. This unmount/mount looks as if she is whispering to her horse. Some surviving stranglers can be killed with the staff before AM is down again. I don't play the build for more than an hour because it needs concentration, but it is a funny build. Dryad has no staff skills, so I used alchemy for hit chance, attack speed and criticals on staff attacks. The character is kinda a shared character, played by everyone of our family. Classmates of my daughters are most often stunned how powerful horse Combat Arts can be.

 

I don't think that some skills are totally useless. Some just need certain other skills/ideas to work.

 

For example you want a dryad bargainer. One of Divine Protection, Alchemy or Enhanced Perception will be needed to unlock bargaining. If I choose alchemy, then I have access to better heal-, mentor- concentration-potions and the trophies. As a caster dryad I would only need one Buff really: barkskin. We all know that most of our spells are overkills in 90% of the fights. So why not use concentration-potions in these 10% and don't take concentration at all. In the 10% tough fights we use a weapon/shield combination with a lot of +CA for our main attack and reduce the higher Reg-time with potions. (My oldest daughter plays such a dryad at the moment, to buy equipment for my kungfu-style dryad).

Edited by chattius
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My 3 fav skills are:

 

Combat Discipline

Concentration; and

Toughness.

 

This thread has enough evidence to show none of the skills are useless, they can all be used in builds, but for 99% of builds, some skills are less essential than others. For ever 3 mentioned as useless, there will be a corresponding post that says they aren't in certain circumstances.

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My must-have-skills:

 

1. Armor Lore. I will never make a char without this. Period. Less regen, more armor, use higher level armor, what about this skill ain't ver, very good?

 

2. Constitution. Everyone who likes living likes having more health. Even so, it is the mastery effect that makes this another skill I always pick.

 

3. Combat Discipline. A pretty damage boost, some regen and then the, sometimes crucial, increased combosize effect. Come to think of it, all my serious characters have ended

up with this.

 

And the ones that I never pick:

 

1. Divine Devotion. Needs no explaination.

 

2. Alchemy. Just not worth the hassle.

 

3. Riding. I will never pick a skill that grants bonuses that cannot be used everywhere. I wouldn't take a "Dungeon Crawling"-skill either.

Edited by Rllulium
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03. riding- all benefits gained ONLY when mounted- faster run speed, riding unlockables[horse only], increases horse ca damage. lowers regen times while mounted on a horse. this skill use only useful if you are mounted and on top of that, only truly useful if you ride a horse. it does not affect ca times when on a non horse[?]. unless you plan on making a horse only character[no character specific Combat Arts/buffs while mounted on a horse], you will be suffering big time. also keep in mind that most bosses are in caves, where mounts are not allowed, so your true effectiveness as a character is diminished in the most crucial times.

Not quite with riding, when on your special mount it decreases the regen penalty & as you can find relics with +riding, you can quite easily have 1 point in it & the rest coming from relics (and any +all skills). IIRC there are only 3 bosses in caves (Carnach, dragon in the human area, the light/shadow dragons under the seraphim island, though that only spawns in the campaign & you can only do one of them, Scorp boss, Crystal boss, Inquisitor boss & the Nameless Guardians I think). Actually, that's quite a lot in caves, only the GarColossus, Octogollamus & Kral bosses are above ground, though all but 2 mini-bosses are above ground.

 

Still, I'd put Riding in the useful-but-niche box.

 

Given that on the consoles the Alchemy consumables have to be accessed via the inventory, I think that reduces it's usefulness somewhat. Speed Lore could definitely do with a buff.

 

Edit: After a think in the car to work, I'd probably put Pacifism & Divine Devotion as the "worst"/least used skills.

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I just can't believe you guys! I used to always pick Alchemy, Riding, and Divine Devotion. I would show you my builds but they are all resting peacefully in the HC graveyard. :D

Really I just can't believe those skills made it into the mix when there could have been much more worth while alternatives.

 

My must have skills

Armor Lore

Concentration

Tactics

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2. Alchemy - don't get me wrong, it's a great skill. However, it is only the Dryad that can utilize it properly, since it's a second tier skill to everyone else.

 

 

Ahhh, but see for a Shadow Warrior Left-Click Build, you must choose Riding. This makes the second tier choice a natural progression of skills choices. For an exotic build like this, choosing Alchemy is as easy as pie.

 

Alchemy is probably the most powerful of all the skills.

 

It can emulate the effects of almost any other skill offered to us, and is an almost over powered boss killer.

 

  1. Chance to Hit
  2. Defense
  3. Critical
  4. Attack Speed
  5. Regeneration Times of all Combat Arts
  6. Evasion
  7. ...many more :D

 

 

 

Alchemy, while an almost over-powered skill choice if effected properly does have challenges while having enormous benefits:

 

  • Requires successful drops to function effectively
  • It's functionality is somewhat clumsy, and is perhaps best suited for use against bosses only, unless someone is brilliantly talented with the button pushing.
  • There is always issue of running out of trophies and having to "farm" just to keep the skill active with trophies.
  • Without Clan or Friends to help with supplying trophies, a person may not bother to get best possible trophies for all possible scenarios.
  • It's effect on Mentor Pots is simply outstanding.
  • Different Trophies stack, so a melee build going into battle, need only activate perhaps Attack Speed and Critical and bosses will melt. The Iron Lore Trophy is now legendary... what, almost a billion points of Physical Armor blinking on? :P (That was a joke, it's more like a few thousand :viking:)

 

It seems like the devs built in a lot of rigors into having to get, first access to this skill, making it difficult to keep powered up, difficult to use effectively. But for players who are interested in the socketing challenges of completely rebalancing a build to reflect temporary powers that can be brought into play that can just about duplicate almost every needed skill and power in the game, Alchemy can't be beat.

 

:4rofl:

 

gogo

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Agreed gogo... However, how often can you pick it and how many builds allow for it? That's the big question... There is no doubt that it's a great skill, but few builds can actually take advantage of it without sacrificing a lot for it :D

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Build intent describes utility.

 

If someone sets out to use Alchemy (which is imo one of the most powerful skill choices in the game if you have resources and energy :D) then the number of builds available is as many as is headliningg any other skill as primary key driver.

 

It is more difficult to use than any other skill, and I`m sure, for all the reasons I listed, it`s been balanced out that wy by Asacron so it`s not abused.

 

As what I would term an exotic skill, and definitely not a mainstream choice, it`s value is probably only going to be realized and used by a smaller number of players because most players will look for very powerful builds that can be executed easily, not with the added ergs of work needed to run Alchemy.

`

:P

 

gogo

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That's an interesting point, gogo. Alchemy can provide challenge to some builds (meaning taking out 1-2 important skills) while providing a lot of balance + power itself, provided you take the time to make it work.

 

When I decide to delete the now-obsolete level 51 shopper Inquisitor, I will make a build with alchemy to check it out. There surely lies a lot more than it meets the eye.

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You know, just talking to you about this here Dobri, has gotten my head whizzing with ideas on how to spec something with Alchemy very very well. Alchemy's synergy with non - ca builds is just incredible. We're talking about a ton of points going into non - ca skill choices, and all finding their way to things like constitution,toughness, tactics, Armor Lore, etc. With those points really solidifying a build from the ground up, the left click attacks are already devastating with now even more ways to enahance the build with Alchemy...which would be the sit-in for the destructiveness of regular Combat Arts...with even more breadth of abilities ^^

 

I've got a Ranged Shadow Warrior coming up the ranks, but now all that's on my mind is a new left click build, very very much focused on Alchemy.

 

yeah, I like this topic.

 

:P

 

gogo

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  • 4 months later...

Bump of worthiness, good read for eveyrone addicted to the game.

 

Course, RPH has changed everything in the game for non-magic players....

 

Definitely adding this to the list of not needed?

 

:)

 

gogo

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Alchemy is still very useful in the 'RpH-Age' of Sacred2.

I really miss alchemy on my PvP-Temple Guardian which I have to play at PvP tournaments with friends at firefighters. I lost in the lottery and I am forced to play a Temple Guardian to niob 140 without dying and then use the same character in PVP tournament. The chance to block root effects, boost physical armour, get RpH , attack value, attack speed just with trophies without sacrificing sockets is very useful in PvP.

I haven't taken warding energy lore (yet- I am just level 61) on my Temple Guardian so I wouldn't place this skill in my top 3. Same for toughness: toughness is useful if you get 70+ damage mitigation from items or spells.

Bargaining is very very useful. Even a character doesn't have it, it will probably have access to items bought by a shopper. I would place armour lore before toughness.

 

I agree with the most useless skills. I never used Divine Devotion, pacifism or spell resistance.

 

Alchemy builds have to be build around alchemy. It's not a choose between two skills like toughness or constitution, shield lore or reflexes, combat discipline or ancient magic. You can't choose between alchemy and another skill. That is the reason that I wouldn't place alchemy in my top 3 skills. But all my new characters which allow alchemy have it. Mainly because I am so used to my trophy shortcuts that I do them automatically without thinking.

 

And 4.0 second RpH at my Temple Guardian and then getting rooted. I really miss my trophies at these situations.

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My most useless skills:

 

1. Divine Devotion

2. Pacifism

3. Spell Resistance

 

I'm 100% Ok for Divine Devotion & pacifism.

But, Spell resistance for chars who don't have energy-shield is not usefull against critical hits from spells (like eye's leech spell) ?

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But, Spell resistance for chars who don't have energy-shield is not usefull against critical hits from spells (like eye's leech spell) ?

 

It is useful against crits and spells but the eye's life leech has a fix damage which can not be reduced by spell resistance.

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With all the above posts in mind and now that we are in the age of Ice and Blood. How does spell resistance pan out. I currently don't have a high level shopper yet. My Temple Guardian bargainer/blacksmith is at 55on plat, waiting for that ride into niob. And all my higher level toons keep dieing due to my headlong dash into danger. My fault not the toon build. Anyway with the detrimental magic and DoT's in Ice and Blood would any of these choices be differant? I still haven't found a way to fight in the swamps yet.

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Before ice and blood, I was running a ranged Shadow Warrior and just with the right mod chosen for his tactics, I found just that alone with the Grim Resillience was enough to stave off a shower of spitters.

 

Course, Ice and Blood`s spitters are a class act, venemous, biting, vitriolic little BLEEPS they`re able to make even the toughest guys squeal.

 

I`d be curious to see interesting strategies of running a melee Shadow Warrior in the swamp while having him level fast. Swamp`s really made for ranged builds ...

 

:devil:

 

gogo

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That's why I'm askin "how can I do it" all I been running is melée toons. I used to enjoy grinding swamp now I run thru as fast as I can. My new challenge along with getting my Shadow Viel Shadow Warrior to be able to run campaigns is to conquer these spiders.

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It's a good question. There's one thing I used to build toons primarily for... and that was for grinding in the swamps...which I believe still beats out other grinding spots. The detrimentals in the swamp are crazy stuff. Before, the swamps used to be anathema to a Shadow Warrior, but now with expansion, it could be a horror? I guess ammy's are the way to go ... anti dot's ...still you'd have to weather a fair bit of the creatures before trying to take them all out... surely there are other places in the game where a Shadow Warrior can get close to a ton of monsters and not have to keep having hp chipped away?

 

:starwars:

 

gogo

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