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Rune Stacking - Yes or No?


Rune Stacking - Yes or No?  

18 members have voted

  1. 1. Should the CM Patch implement rune stacking?

    • Yes
      13
    • No
      5

This poll is closed to new votes


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3 hours ago, Schot said:

For fun, I created a site wide announcement pointing to this topic to see if we can get more feedback...

@Dragon Brother I looked but didn't see an option to remove your vote.  I'll probably look around more.  That should be an option!

In case you're interested, the announcement does not seem to appear on the "Default" theme (I.e. the non "Sacred 4.2 (Default)" theme).

Mmm I thought I might be able to change it, but no luck. To be honest, I don't think I'm really fussed though, so whether my vote is yay or nay...I'm happy to go either way.

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  • This topic was featured and unfeatured

I voted 'No'. Saving inventory space by stacking runes would have been great but it then brings something new and breaks some other things. Maybe you can keep that 'feature' for the 'Enhanced Edition'?

Like said 'Fixing something that isn't broken'; it shouldn't come with the CM Patch.

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8 hours ago, Dragon Brother said:

In case you're interested, the announcement does not seem to appear on the "Default" theme (I.e. the non "Sacred 4.2 (Default)" theme).

 

Thanks DB, will look at that today

of all the skins, the default should be the one it works with most easily

:)

 

gogo

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It would be a nice feature. The problem with different runes up- or downgrading only appears when u change the difficulty AND u want to forge runes into your weapons/armor. So its really REALLY circumstantial. And u could always upgrade runes anyway at the rune guy. Ofc it would cost some gold, but gold isnt really a recource that matters in sacred. The only time it matters, is when u create a new char and need a mount.

I also dont think, that many people forge runes, most will just increase the CA directly. And higher tier runes give the same +1 to the CA as lower runes do. So there should really be no problem.

The change would reduce micromanagement and save time.

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1 hour ago, dimitrius154 said:

Ladies and Gentlemen, the difficulty level filter is in. Stackable items will only stack if they are of the same difficulty, effectively removing property mismatch. Stacks have been increased to 99.

So the potential cheating is no more? If so, then there's no harm in stacking runes and my "no" becomes a yes.

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Bravo all, this topic's turned out so well! Schot's idea to bring the topic up head and center... we've never done that before and we've illicited a lot of responses.  As Flix said, it's great seeing the community come out to make these decisions... heartwarming...the force is still strong in sacred

:heart:
 

gogo

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12 hours ago, dimitrius154 said:

Ladies and Gentlemen, the difficulty level filter is in. Stackable items will only stack if they are of the same difficulty, effectively removing property mismatch. Stacks have been increased to 99.

 

1 hour ago, Flix said:

Downloading Dmitriy's update now.  I'm about to test this.  If it looks ok, I guess my objections would evaporate, and this debate would become moot, and rune stacking will go ahead as an official feature of the CM Patch.  :dance2:

I really appreciate all the feedback, and thanks to Gogo and Schot for making that big alert at the top of the forum.  Really nice when the "Community" part of the CM Patch comes into play.  

Cool!  I didn't even have to vote.  Awesome work guys.  :)

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  • 2 weeks later...

I think I originally voted "No", but have been thinking about this after voting.

What I would like to see would be a new quest to become a "Rune Master".

I don't remember much about how runes work but, for the "Rune Master Quest":

Level 1 (Apprentice): 100 runes must be combined. The base rune must be the same and all attributes (up to the max allowed) will be added to the base rune. If one rune has a 5% chance of something and another has a 15% chance, the new rune would have a 20% chance.

Level 2 (Journeyman): After successfully merging 100 runes, you can now merge different runes. Again, you must merge another 100 runes. You can merge up to three runes at a time. The first rune will determine the base of the new rune and the subsequent runes will just add attributes.

Level 3 (Master): Now when you merge runes, if the primary attribute goes over 100% or 999 or whatever the maximum attribute is, the Rune Level will get bumped up to the next level and the primary attribute will drop down to 5% or something similar.

This way we could not only create a character that does our shopping, we could create a character to combine all those hard earned runes we find all over the place.

Edited by Spock
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  • 9 months later...

I'm quite sad to see the votes being mostly "yes" as this seems like a rather bad idea due the to the consequences. I also really worry about, if not hate, the thought of a handful of people voting yes causing changes that affect far far more other people.

I also don't think it's just a matter of worrying about someone exploiting it, I'm not so worried about that as people will find a way if that's what they want regardless. Though making it easy with an ingame mechanic is something that can be argued against.

Regardless I'm more worried about this resulting in good or better runes being lost due to it stacking with lesser runes. People who don't know about it are going to have a bad time and lets face it the changelog for CM Patch is already so big chances are no one reads the whole thing when they decide to try it just like people don't read EULAs, at most some people might read the most recent changes. This does not make them unreasonable, it's just the way people are especially with something called a patch rather than a modification.

Also as someone who would know about it I don't want to have to compare items on the ground to ones in the inventory any more than absolutely necessary. It sounds like it's going to be an annoyance while breaking the pace of things to make sure I'm not losing something. I can see it getting really frustrating having to check the inventory and compare things every time a rune drops, this could get more than just annoying.

I'm not aware of what limitations you may have with the alterations you can make with CM Patch though there are many better ways to handle something like this, and if those limitations mean this is the only way you can handle it then it's far better left alone.


If such a change is implemented it should be optional and opt-in, that way people who don't know about it don't suddenly start losing better runes and people who don't want to be annoyed with more inventory-comparing don't have to be. (the way the Morrowind Code Patch handles such options is a decent example)

There are already mods that basically allow more inventory space and I also think this falls more into the "mod" category than "patch" so all the more reason to make it an opt-in optional. This is beyond the purview of a "patch", this is not fixing something, this is an alteration based on personal preference.

There are many community/user made patches for many games, and it's very unfortunate when they start taking liberties with the changes they make while calling themselves a "patch". It's a slippery slope when a Patch starts taking to many liberties with the alterations made, some have even become hated due to such behavior which is a shame. So I suggest caution when adding such "mod" like alterations to something called a "patch", both for the sake of fans and the project itself.

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I'll edit the lead post to make it clear that as this project developed, all of my arguments for voting "NO" were allayed.  In the end I was (and am) wholly convinced that this was a good idea.  It unfolded over the course of the thread, but isn't obvious from the get-go just why things turned out the way they did.

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7 hours ago, Androdion said:

Hi Sacroo

Two things that you're missing on your argument:

  1. Runes from different difficulty levels (power) don't stack with one another. A Bronze rune will only stack with another (exactly) equal Bronze rune, a Silver rune with a Silver rune, etc etc. So you never loose anything because what actually stacks are items of the same category and level and power. No harm for the player and no need for micromanagement.
  2. This was a decision made by the community for a community made patch. It's not a Mod, it's a patch, but it's still made by a community which has a vision which will be most likely different from the original vision on certain instances. So when such an instance arises the community has a voice in it, as to decide if it strays too far from the original vision or if its implementation goes in line without spoiling it. Which is what happened on this topic.

I hope you understand that you're not missing out on anything due to this being a part of the CM Patch, and that none of this was made "just because". It was thought of, presented to the public and voted for. Democratically I might say. ;)

Bravo, very well said.

Sacred 2's always been about the community, and it's been one of the coolest, strongest, strangest games in this sense. 

Perhaps why we've had a community this strong over ten years later who are still so engaged with it's vision.

Passionate crafting allied with a great sense of heart and generosity. 

Many people wanting to listen to each other.

This game's spirit has never been anything less

 

:gogo:

 

gogo

 

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  • 1 year later...
  • 1 year later...

FWIW, someone implemented rune stacking, in the latest CM patch, but when you go to try to hand  a rune to a rune-master, there doesn't seem to be a way to split them so it won't allow you to use them.  If you go to a merchant and try to sell, it asks if you want to sell these 2 items, but after the sale, they only have 1 in stock.

While the idea might be nice, seems like there might be some unanticipated problems.

 

This is the same CM patch that has the full opacity labels to make things easier to read, except that they block icons and items on the map.  So sad.

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