Sets can be the crutch or are you hopelessly addicted to them

[EvilMale 7]

Ok is it just me or do you find your self planning what set to use and in the end get so BORED with it you end up tossing it and then shopping like crazy for gear that boost your Combat Arts just for better killing power cause I know I really hate to read runes and I would much rather boost my Combat Arts from gear.

[Nihilith 0]

So far, I don't have any set piece I can use lol. This problem doesn't apply to me. But I love shopping ! more flexibility, and a better chance to get what you look for. but that takes hours lol. I don't think I will use complete set, but parts. Except for a full thorwyn Vamp : SeXy

[Therion X 19]

I think it varies from Char to Char.

My Mage for example.. I did a huge Shopping Session with him around lvl80. And now, at lvl145, with the same Equipment, he still rules Enemies around lvl200

 

On the other Hand.. the Daemoness just needs Sets to boost certain CAs or Spells, as she can't get Boni for them from a Trader (except Soaring Daemon = Hard Hit and Battle Daemon = Attack)... so, she's kinda doomed (but it's possible to get a CA/Spell up to 510, I recently got Poison Daemon up there)

[erialc 2]

My DE wears Ethans for sneaking but then swaps out a weapon for non sneaking ...my demons wear a mix and match of stuff. I guess I'll wear whats best at the time

[promatolya 5]

only chars I would consider full sets is a mage with full blackstaff (if shardmage offcourse)

a WE with the snow set (god I hate names, allways forget em)

vamp with thorwyn

 

other then that I am rather convinced a combo of diff sets along with some uniques and specific rares give overall better results

 

just my 2 cents tough

[gogoblender 3,069]

I think sets are great for peeps wanting to get a good "feel" for the mechanics of the game. A while ago, I used to create entire builds by going to Pev's Set site and just imagining builds based on the benefits of what I saw from the sets and their completed bonuses in front of me. Lately I've been mixing and matching...most set bonuses pre-UW are kind of smallish and not all that useful to my builds. But Post UW set bonuses have some interesting bonuses.

I guess this alldepends on the experience levels of the person making the builds, how much they know about equipment that exists out there, and the kinds of uniques that they'd have set in their minds to especially look for or trade with others with.

 

 

gogo

[EvilMale 7]

I agree Gogo but Still I find most of the time I am when I am starting a new toon I start getting back in the old mind set of What Set To Use and that is probably due to habit more than anything else. My Ms Mage has been totally revamped with Shopped Items and uniques and I have found that I get get a bigger bonus to my spells and get the most out of his killing power by totally getting away from sets.

[Nihilith 0]

[...] A while ago, I used to create entire builds by going to Pev's Set site and just imagining builds based on the benefits of what I saw from the sets and their completed bonuses in front of me. [...]

 

 

gogo

 

Hum anyone else wants to try Reverse character building. You make the char according to what boni you have... may be funny in hardcore lol.

I'm in a hurry to see a seraphim with only conversion... don't laugh, I'm sure gogo could make it viable

 

Nihi

[Funkilicious 1]

If a set piece comes along and is better than what I am wearing then I will use it, but definitely weigh up the pros and cons of the pieces at the time.

 

My seraphim for example has a good mix of uniques, set and magical items and is handling platinum comfortably.

 

I know some ppl like the extra bonuses from sets but if the build is right then bonuses shouldn't be a concern.

[Silearth 6]

I always say that I am going to build a toon that doesn't use any sets at all. And to be completly honest, there are blue items that look like set items; they usually have such high stats that I am reluctant to part with them when I find the actual set pieces.

There are two types of set bonuses that I have a hard time giving up. They are unresisted damage:dark,blood,secret..... and permanent buffs like HC from Raanes and GM from blackstaff.

[gogoblender 3,069]

heh, good point Sil. I keep telling myself I'm one day going to make a toon all from odd parts...but the fact of the matter is...sets are easy to find. Odds are basically uniques right? Think about it. What's the chance that you'll ever find another odd part like the one you're using. However...compare this to the chance of finding a set item that has great general utility for your build...and you'll see why they're popular.

Not cuz they're the best...but because they're...

common?

ooooooooooooh

 

gogo

[Arilaftia 0]

I tend to build the most by what attributes each piece gives that I want to boost. Although I do really want to play with the set bonuses, its hard to just switch around for me. Although, I am the same way with Thorwins, than add on the Recundis sword/shield and rampage its just too hard to switch out of those!

[Silearth 6]

I guess I'm just lucky...well most of the time. There are certain uniques that I strive to get for certain toons/builds. I usually end up with them either through luck of drops or some one calling me to the island to show me something only to find that the 'something' is the unique I had been looking for.

For the BM I have to have Ehlonor's magic gloves--it's a requirement! Lol. Guess what? My BM is still in bronze, but my plat dwarf is holding a pair for him. Chances are high that I'll get a lower level pair before I hit gold.

Try to build strictly with blue and yellow items.

To be honest, a good blue items is usually better than a good yellow item of the same level.

[gial 2]

For my current character, I had a plan in mind when I started. This plan does not include a set, but does possibly include certain pieces of some sets, because I know they boost what I want.

 

The Ettol bow is not a requirement for my we, but it does seem to be the best available so far. Other than that, all I want from equipment is boost to Combat Arts and rsm and sockets.

[DaveO 88]

I don't feel my current devotion to the Wood Elf Blizzard set is an addiction. It's more of an exercise to see how far a hybrid magic/ranged build can go in terms of damage. My Call of the Ancestors with the build is significantly powerful, but I've yet to reach the true potential of damage with Poison Tendrils or the immobility ability of Plant Cage. I suspect that if the Plant Cage is high enough, trapping D'Cay in it will be 'snow' problem

[EvilMale 7]

I know when I started this conversation I was playing my MS BM. and there just wasn't a set that would boost up my MS spell high enough for me. And I got really annoyed with that fact so I hit the merchants and shopped until I was happy with my set-up. But as of now I probably have re-done some of my thinking as I have been Pushing a new Build to the Limits. I found my self really enjoying some of the new set bonuses with Amarri's. I can't say yet that I am addicted to it. I would still rather mix and match sets with shopped for gear and uniques. But I will admit that this is one set bonus that I do enjoy. Heck who doesn't Enjoy Dealing out MASS amounts of DMG and mowing down the mobs of Ancaria or even UnderWorld

[Csaszar 2]

Hi

 

 

Well to answer your original question: its depending on that particular set. If the set has a worthy full bonus then yes.

[Genenut 8]

Beyond my napalm mage's addiction to byleths burning bone (special damage) or my shards mage who is still trying to get blackstaffs complete set (for the boost to water and air spells) I dont build to a set.

 

my daemon is being built solely on a damage type/amount principal so I want to try a full faldamar axe vs thains dual weild vs weapon and shield and then which ever c/a daemon form gets me the most damange. I proabaly will use all 5 forms so that I can change damange types depending on the region im in.

 

my wood elf was built based onthe c/a not the set pieces so what ever comes along that helps the most towards that goal is what I'm taking (shes a spider arrow we) again she will want to try a full ettols bow to see what that does for her and her damage but she can and is living without it.

[Zinsho 0]

For me it varies, I'll mix and match things to get the highest possible bonuses out of my setup, be it via set or shopped item (unless I don't have trading, then it is almost sure to be sets/very nice found items). Sets provide large bonuses that fill gaps that are hard to avoid with rares unless you spend a lot of time hunting. Uniques too, my Seras almost ALWAYS use Arhles' wings unless/until they get to the point where it doesn't matter, they have enough damage/WIDD to compensate for the losses. Then again my current hybrid uses Sereish gloves and belt, not because they're all that good for her in general, however when she adds in her RBoL slot (sword+shield) it adds a large bonus to RBoL on top of the base bonus from the items themselves, which is already quite nice. I'm pretty sure my increase on that switch is on par with +40-50, in gold.

 

However, one thing regarding the 'secret' damages. Unless I've completely lost my mind and forgotten a few of my testings, they add NOTHING. Take a seraphim or a Glad, quite easy to demonstrate it with them due to their buffs that last quite long and that deal noticeable amounts of damage. Wear your entire set and cast RBoL/Light/CL/Dagger Stare etc. Get a few damage displays on screen against one given enemy, say 2 or 3, and then remove the item and watch the damage afterwards. Get a screenshot of both damage sets and get out of there (or keep killing and do the rest later).

 

Look at the screenshot afterwards, compare damages. I do believe I'd done this in the past with dagger stare and the result was the same, total damage was total damage, regardless of the portion that was 'unresisted'. A simpler demonstration, that I'm sure everyone has seen. If you have 10% 'special' damage on a listed 1000 damage from a damage over time spell it should deal 100 damage regardless of enemy. However it won't deal 100, it'll deal out 10% of the resulting damage output post-resists.

 

In other words, more lag, more chance for OW/Split/Gold Drop etc, and a few extra display features, but no real 'bonus' as far as how quickly you kill things.

[Genenut 8]

I can say when I forget a piece of my byleths set I do notice a drop in damage. The burning bone does add to the total damage I do with my fire mage. maybe it depends on the type of damage you are doing as your primary?

[Zinsho 0]

Burning bones is different though, it's added damage over time ala Open Wounds. I'm referring to Amarri's, Talia Mel and the like, those are just changing the graphics for damage and adding an extra damage display number.

[EvilMale 7]

I have to disagree there Zin in the early stages of my build I had NO SET items and no full set. the Secret DMG is quite real infact, that it adds to the total dmg over all in a spell cast. (not just graphic) I tested this fact as I entered plat. the other night. and found that 1 I do kill slower with out the added Dmg which is immediate not time over all as you stated.

[DaveO 88]

In regards to the special damages adding nothing, I'm fairly certain the Forest Golem was taken down in a large part by my Blizzard WE set. Remember, the dagger is pitiful in terms of damage and anything that can either boost its physical attack abilities(like the Gladiator's Hard Hit) or increase its non-physical damages will make the Golem go down a lot faster.

[Csaszar 2]

Hi

 

 

My experience in this:

 

the so called "secret" damage is not a bonus damage (like +12% fire damage) BUT for a XX% amount of your original damage converted into that special kind of damage. Because of this mechanism - equipping or reequipping a set piece (what completes a special damage bonus) wont show any modification in damage. BUT - and this is what really important is - secret damage means a LOT. Not because it adds more damage (well it does in a way - but because the secret damage simply can not resisted - and this is a very big bonus.

 

I did an experiment with my GoW BM. I removed Amarri helm - so no secret damage - and exchanged it with Blackstaff's helm which has a nice bonus to GoW on it. The results were quite interesting.

I used level 100 gow (modified to 140 with Blackstaff helm) and the lab rat was a War Golem in Vot (hehe lotsa Golems to be more precise).

 

The LISTED damage jumped a lot with Blackstaffs helm on and the actual damage numbers (the flying numbers no screen) were much higher than wearing Amarri helm (and having secret damage) BUT the same Golem died slower.

 

In short: secret damage isnt a direct bonus damage but a xx% portion of total damage which cannot be resisted.

 

I have extensively tested secret damage with Dark Elf and Battle Mage and after my experience Secret Damage MEANS A LOT (damage wise)

 

CS.

[gogoblender 3,069]

Very interesting here and I love the discussion that Zinsho has brought into play here.

If the secret damage is unresisted, I can see why it wouldn't be shown as listed damage. Kind of like the way that crit or WIDD won't show up as listed. But we can definitely the positive delta in damge when using these mods who's damage is NOT listed by looking at differences in manifested ingame damage numbers that float up.

 

Csaszar and DavO wouldthis method of comparing data then be useful for Secret Damage proof then?

 

By taking screenies of damage that floats off the enemy before and after using secret damage as comparison of proof? Guess we'd have to use a range of hits to produce an average?

 

Also can secret damage's effects be seen while using ANY damage dealing CA?

 

I was thinking that a good test of this would be using a celestial light on a stuck ingame toon.(wow, wish we had dummies )

 

If secret damage actually was working, more damage would go through and we'd see a higher value of damage being manifested live and in game correct?

 

Thanks Csaszar and DaveO for your remarks about how the damage would NOT be listed and we would 'FEEL" secret damage's effects by monsters dying faster.

 

I'm just wondering if there is a great way of showing an increase of evinced damage with screenies now.

 

 

gogo