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Metagame guides: developing builds (viable idea?)


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Hi!

I'm new here (and new to wiki stuff), so I've wrote a little introduction. This way you know why I'm here :cow_white:

 

More to the point:

I've wrote a reeee(...)eeeeally long article on the official italian forum ( have fun reading this if you understand italian ;) ) about the art of developing Daemon's builds (it was written for non-newbye players).

 

Part 1 - Simply an introduction with some information about how the Daemon that I needed to be known by the reader

Part 2 - "Combat Styles", in other words the basics of building (list and analysis of all the possible main attacks for the Deamon, except for magic, that is analyzed later)

Part 3 - Neat and clear description of the spells' effects

Part 4 - The core of my work: sinergies and incopatibility between Daemon's arts and Combat Styles

Part 5 - Some build example

Part 6 - Tips & tricks

 

 

A part from part 5, which could be interesting (a collection of very effective builds and possible variations would be a nice thing to add to the character's descriptions - Soaring Daemon, Poison Daemon and Fire Daemon builds I.e.), what I think could be usefull are the informations in part 4 (for Daemons) and in part 2 (for a general understanding of how to build effectively and the analysis for the possible Daemon's Combat Styles).

 

Do you think this would fit in the wiki? It's the first time I work on a wiki, so I don't know how "far" it should go.

 

 

What I'm talking is something like "when are Tentacles useful in a build?", "did you noticed that Tentacles and Abysmal Choir are almost the same thing? exactly as Hell Sphere and Blazing Disc?", "why Hell Sphere is always worst than Blazing Disc?" (I have the proof :) ), "which is the ONLY case in which I can use Hell Sphere in a build without adding a useless spell?".

I think you got the idea. But it's important that you don't misunderstand one point. I've seen many builds using AC/spells that does not fit, at all, with the philosophy under which the builds were developed: it's to do not let such things happen that I wrote my "guide". It's not about "use this and do not use that", but "if I want to use this, what should I add to my build and what I shouldn't, in order to make it a working build?".

 

 

In case you are not totally sure of what is my idea is, I'll post a translation of part 4 (hoping that it will not be wasted by a "we don't think it's a good idea" after the translation :P ).

 

:)

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The best way to look at a wiki is like an encyclopaedia. A lot of peeps have great knowledge, but finding a good place on the wiki that offers utility to everyone coming after is the tricky part. What you could possibly do is look at the index, see where knowledge that you are interested in writing about would make sense, and then add it in to the already existing content or...

make a new heading for for the data you want to add on a previous index page and use the bb code at the top which automatically makes any word in the wiki connect to

 

 

1-another page that is headed with that word

2-will create a NEW page upon which you can write.

 

For your daemon synergies, for example, you could go to this page here

 

http://darkmatters.org/SacredWiki/index.php5/Daemon

 

which is the Daemon root page, click on edit at the top and add another linkable page to that root page called Daemon Synergies.

 

click submit and on that root page you'll have a new link to a new page that you can travel to and add your knowledge too. On that root page, you can add to already existing content there by doing a description of the Daemon, then click submit. Bingo...knowledge added.

 

I'd like to write more, but I'm running off to work...again Shard, great that the project interests you and I think many of us are excited about info on the Sacred Metagame.

 

Unlimited pages...have fun!

 

:cow_white:

 

gogo

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Hi :viking:

 

Sorry I cant let this out:

"which is the ONLY case in which I can use Hell Sphere in a build without adding a useless spell?"

 

Hell Sphere has its own place at the armory of a demon. Maybe not as a main Spell but it could be greatly useful in quite a lot situation AND it could be your ride to glory with a low level Demon who has lotsa runes want level fast but do not wants to screw a major CA with too high level.

 

hehe sorry again :viking:

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Hi :lol:

 

Sorry I cant let this out:

"which is the ONLY case in which I can use Hell Sphere in a build without adding a useless spell?"

 

Hell Sphere has its own place at the armory of a demon. Maybe not as a main Spell but it could be greatly useful in quite a lot situation AND it could be your ride to glory with a low level Demon who has lotsa runes want level fast but do not wants to screw a major CA with too high level.

 

hehe sorry again :D

 

 

Blazing Disc (BD)

Regen time: Medium

Target: Single

Type of attack: Dynamical Creation (Direct Damage)

Average Damage: 12k (physical) + 14k (fire)

Duration: 60 seconds (max)

 

 

Hell Sphere (HS)

Regen time: Medium

Target: Single

Type of attack: Statical Creation (Direct Damage)

Average Damage: 9k (magic) + 9k (fire)

Duration: 45 seconds (max)

 

Those are the data (average damage took at same spell level, character level, MR and gear).

 

As you can see:

 

1) regen time and target are the same

2) BD last longer than HS

3) BD damage > HS damage, and for what concern the sinergy of fire damage with infernal power BD base fire damage > HS base fire damage

 

What we need to evaluate now is how the two spells works ("type of attack" in my terminology).

HS create objects that remain staticly in the point where they were created (Statical Creation), and they attack a single target ("Target: Single") with a periodical attack that deals damage immediatly (Direct damage) - opposed to the periodic damage, like the one that comes with poison attacks -

BD create objects that move with you after they have been created (Dynamical Creation), and - this part is exactly the same as in the HS case -

 

So if point 1 and 2 are on par, point 4 and 5 are BD's win, we need to understand, from the way the spells work, if there are certain tactical situation where the way HS work is better than the way BD work, even if HS deals lower total damage, lower fire damage and last a shorter.

The point is that the only difference in the way HS and BD work is that HS creates something "static", while BD creates something "dynamic", that can follow you (even if you are a trapper you are going to move very often, in order to find new monsters).

So the point is that with HS you have to re-create all the spheres anytime you move a bit far from the previous battleground, which you don't with BD.

 

Even when teaming with a trapper BD is better, just because dynamic > static.

 

 

In any case you BD > HS, so you can use HS only if you already use BD (otherwise you should change HS with BD). The point is that you need to constantly recast both BD and HS, so you can use both of them only if the regen time of BD is lower than that of HS (it's nonsense to cast frequently HS while casting BD sporadically). This way you cast lots of BD at low regen time (they are your main attack) and, to increase your total damage, you cast every now and then (cuz of "long" regen time) HS (this way HS's damage is higher (more runes than BD) and the single attacks are better).

 

I could write a bit more about this tactic, but for a deeper discussion I would need too much time, and I'm already late for my jogging :P

 

 

l8r :D

 

P.S. (just to remark the important point)

The point is that HS = BD with less damage (and fire damage), less duration and statical creation. They seem really different, but if you analyse them you see that there are no difference apart from the static/dynamic attribute of the object created.

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Ah very very interesting stuff Shard. This would make a fantastic public discussion I think.

 

To take your comparison a step further even it occurs to me this comparison as well:

 

BS

Has the ability to travel with you

frequency of hits - quick

 

HS

Does not need to come in contact with target and can have full screen range of attack. (Furthermore, I believe it can attack anything within your characters sight effectively and possibley making HS's range of attack one screen and a half. *unproven*

Remains static in that it does not move.

frequency of hits - moderate

 

And of course there is the major point of type of damage. Depending on what your enemy's resistances are can greatly affect conclusions as to a "best" CA as well as comparing casting speeds.

 

This sort of information that you have presented here and on the Italian site is of absolute value Shard.

 

I salute you! ;)

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