High Level CA and Attribute Tables/results

[Cocytus 0]

So, Hi, I'm New Here, etc.

 

Just picked up Sacred 2, and found that while the interface is MUCH improved from the last, there still a very deep sense of needing to plan for effectiveness, what with the heavy correlation between various CAs/attributes, and the fact that you can't respec as necessary. With 200 levels and 905(?) total skill points by that last level, there's a fair amount of planning that can/needs be done. I couldn't find much info on the CA pages, so I'm going to attempt to slap in data for tables showing what you can expect to see, number/%-wise, as you increase Combat Arts and attributes, solely by themselves (naked, and only increasing one attribute/CA at a time). I hope to answer some questions I haven't been able to on the way, such as why some Combat Arts, say Grand Invigoration, seem to increase by tenths of a point as opposed to whole point increases.

 

Hmm, and a little more searching seems to have cut some of my work out for me, so that's good. The wiki still seems to need some good, raw data, so if I'm missing anything obvious about the game mechanics or available data, please let me know.

 

Oh, and I've done very little wiki-editing so bear with my growing pains, please.

Edited December 22, 2008 by Cocytus

[Little Sara 1]

Its 921 skill points, counting the 10 "free" skill points (picking a skill makes it lv 1).

 

The problem with trying to do what you said: ie increasing CAs naked and one at a time and such, is that regeneration time and maximum CA level without penalty both vary with level. Hence your data at lv 1 would be very different from data at lv 50, lv 100 or lv 200.

 

Here's a rundown though:

 

CA damage -> increases with player level (due to automatically assigned atttributes), increases with CA level

 

CA regeneration time -> diminishes with player level, increases with CA level

CA cooldown time -> fixed time, only affected by mods

 

Buff penalty on regeneration time of all combat arts -> diminishes with player level, increases with CA level, only applicable when the buff is on obviously

 

Secondary effects -> depending on which, may diminish with player levels, armor (of hireling) increases with CA level (not sure about player level), many increase with player levels, %-based ones seem to diminish based on player levels (chance for shrunken heads is one).

 

Maximum level without penalty of CA -> Increases with character level and with appropriate Focus-type skill. Provides diminishing returns as it gives 0.33 CA maximum at first, but then it becomes 0.20 per level.

 

Going above maximum level has benefits, and penalties. The only one without penalties is Grand Invigoration (only bonuses, no malus, and its a buff, so no regeneration time there).

 

Pros: Slightly higher damage/better effects/longer lasting time

Cons: Less cost-effective, CA regeneration time increases per rune read while damage/effects increases per effective level.

Alternative: Combat Arts+ on items provides 1/2 of the regeneration time increase for a full effective level (yet it won't go past the maximum level without penalty without being slowed down as well).

 

Example:

 

I read 5 runes and have Battle Stance at lv 5.

I get full benefits in terms of cost-effectiveness: I'm getting lv 5 effectiveness for 5 runes.

 

I read 25 runes and have Battle Stance lv 15.4 (hypothetical)

I get the benefits of effective level 15.4, but the "Regeneration of all combat arts" penalty worth 25 runes.

 

Alternative example:

 

I read 25 runes and have Battle Stance +7 from equipment, it gives me Battle Stance 19.4 (hypothetical)

I get the benefits of effective level 19.4, and the "Regeneration of all combat arts" penalty worth 25 +7/2 (or 28.5) runes.

 

-------------------

 

At some point, even if you were to only use buffs and didnt care if it had a huge +400% regeneration of all combat arts penalty, the effective level would 'cap'. The increases are 1 full effective level at first, then 0.4, 0.3, 0.2, 0.1, less than 0.1...and at some point you'd need 100 runes to even give 0.1 etc

Edited December 22, 2008 by Little Sara

[gogoblender 3,068]

So, Hi, I'm New Here, etc.

 

Just picked up Sacred 2, and found that while the interface is MUCH improved from the last, there still a very deep sense of needing to plan for effectiveness, what with the heavy correlation between various CAs/attributes, and the fact that you can't respec as necessary. With 200 levels and 905(?) total skill points by that last level, there's a fair amount of planning that can/needs be done. I couldn't find much info on the CA pages, so I'm going to attempt to slap in data for tables showing what you can expect to see, number/%-wise, as you increase Combat Arts and attributes, solely by themselves (naked, and only increasing one attribute/CA at a time). I hope to answer some questions I haven't been able to on the way, such as why some Combat Arts, say Grand Invigoration, seem to increase by tenths of a point as opposed to whole point increases.

 

Hmm, and a little more searching seems to have cut some of my work out for me, so that's good. The wiki still seems to need some good, raw data, so if I'm missing anything obvious about the game mechanics or available data, please let me know.

 

Oh, and I've done very little wiki-editing so bear with my growing pains, please.

 

 

Sweet

 

We were hoping that someone would know how to put up the progression for awhile now. We had it done with the Sacred original Wiki, and it turned out to be pretty useful.

 

Thanks for the help Cocytus

 

And, as well, welcome to Darkmatters!

 

 

gogo

 

p.s. no worries with with the wiki coding..it's pretty easy and learns fast...if you have any questions just post and we'll help as quick as we can. Cheers!

[Schot 407]

That would be absolutely wonderful Cocytus.

 

With some base CA numbers we could then apply skill and attribute bonuses to the bases in order to project future levels. Perhaps in time even develop a calculator of sorts. I'm thinking for this kind of data that it would be best done on a level 1 character? That way we could apply stat bonuses easily I think. It's quite a big project though. What you might consider for starters is something like what we did with Sacred 1. Something like these tables; Battle Mage Combat Arts. We just documented certain levels in order to give an impression of the combat art. Doing every possible level might be exhausting.

 

If you need help learning the tables or other things I'd be happy to help and there are also others here who have developed a great understanding of the wiki as well.

[Schot 407]

Oh, forgot about the CA limit from character level and Focus. I guess what will have to happen is to use a level 200 character with the relative Focus maxed. I did test this a while ago and it was very difficult to get the CA I tested above level 150. It will be interesting to see how we can improve that cap. After some CA data is collected we might then subtract the bonuses from all related attributes and the relative focus. Maybe get some base numbers that way to use for projecting.

[Llama8 8]

CA regeneration time -> diminishes with player level, increases with CA level

Buff penalty on regeneration time of all combat arts -> diminishes with player level, increases with CA level, only applicable when the buff is on obviously

 

Actually, CA regen time decreases with increasing Stamina (which increases with character level, which is why regen time appears to decrease with character level).

 

Buff CA regen malus also decreases with Stamina (& Focus level) rather than character level.

 

why some Combat Arts, say Grand Invigoration, seem to increase by tenths of a point as opposed to whole point increases.

 

The bonus from GI (improved regen time for all CAs, regardless of aspect & no CA regen penalty) was probably deemed too powerful, so the increase per level was reduced to tenths of a % in order to balance it. After all, all other buffs have a CA regen malus to balance out their bonuses.