Can enhanced perception be supplemented mostly by chance to find valuables? (nvm wish I could delete)

[MagicalHorseman 1]

I'm still experimenting and trying to understand how the game works, but from what information is on the wiki and what I have gathered here thus far. I have noticed that there is an item modifier called chance to find valuables, that is not only a major part of enhanced perception but something you can get with relative ease without the skill. From what I can gather the other major part of enhanced perception only helps you find additional places to loot and to detect invidible enemies. However on the wiki I noticed they mentioned a bonus to "magic find". I am a bit conflicted as to what magic find does and where it comes from within enhanced. I can't tell if it's a seperate thing from the two main portions of enhanced perception or what. Which makes me question if I could supplement the most important part of enhanced perception (finding better loot) or if there is something I can only get from enhanced perception that effects it more then just having more places to loot.

EDIT: I've realized I need enhanced perception for the modifier to even exist outside the skill

Edited May 16, 2022 by MagicalHorseman

[idbeholdME 387]

3 hours ago, MagicalHorseman said:

EDIT: I've realized I need enhanced perception for the modifier to even exist outside the skill

Chance to find valuables can spawn in 2 versions. 1 is bound to Enhanced Perception, requires it to work and its actual value depends on the level of the skill itself. The other is just a native bonus that has a set value depending on which difficulty/item level the item is that works even without the skill.

Here is a great example item:

As you can see, my character does not have Enhanced Perception (as clearly shown in the locked XP per kill modifier), but the item has the version of the mod that does not depend on the skill. So a rare level 180 item from Niobium will give you about 21% of CtFV. For reference, a level 155 Set Item with CtFV gives about 25%.

As for the original question, the answer is going to be mostly no. Reaching the same amount of CtFV from items is going to be very difficult and will require a lot of sacrifices. The values of the item bonuses are pretty low. Even in high level Niob, a single item piece will give about 20-25% CtFV or so at best. EP is both the most available and the most powerful source of CtFV. EP Mastery alone gives you a whopping 180%. Add 3 relics with EP and any all skills bonuses you might have on gear, and you can easily get 300+% just for 75 points in EP. Whenever you can squeeze it in on a build, it helps a lot. Combine that with a high survival bonus and map revealed % and you will be drowning in sets.

Edited May 16, 2022 by idbeholdME

[Androdion 875]

My take on EP? If you want to use it you will want to have it as a primary mastery (one of your first three), because you'll always want to keep it at char level when levelling up to reap its benefits when doing so, and after that leave it at 75 points and use relic bonuses and/or gear bonuses to farm what you need to farm. Just don't compromise attack and defense for a small chance to find better gear though. Legendaries will still have a measly chance to drop, so don't gimp your toon because of post-mastery level EP.

CTFV is a bonus native to every toon, and it grows naturally with percentage of map revealed if I'm not mistaken, but if you want that value to be big enough to not collect trash then you'll always need EP. At mastery level it basically turns all regular loot into rare tier loot, sometimes with better bonuses than what you'd get regularly. Higher tier gear (sets and legendaries) though will still only drop specifically when enabled by their loot tables, so if you're after EP to fill yourself with greens and oranges at every curve of the game... I wouldn't get my hopes too high.

[idbeholdME 387]

14 hours ago, Androdion said:

At mastery level it basically turns all regular loot into rare tier loot, sometimes with better bonuses than what you'd get regularly.

Good point which I forgot to mention. Rare items for example can drop from 4 or 5 tiers (9-13) and tiers determine the "quality" of the item. Tier 9 has 117.5% quality, while 13 has 129%. So a tier 13 rare item will have a ~10% better values on the same item mods than a tier 9 rare item. Also, some mods have a better probability of spawning at higher quality levels, which CtFV helps reach. CtFV basically increases all the probabilities for a certain tier by its amount.

This is a very good link.

http://www.sacredwiki.org/index.php/Sacred_2:Item_quality_levels_vs_Enhanced_Perception_-_Magic_Find_-_Bargaining

 

Also, you can see the base probabilities for all the item tiers in the balance.txt file. Default values are these:

  ZRareExpectation15 = 2, (0.2%)
  ZRareExpectation14 = 6, (0.6%)
  ZRareExpectation13 = 14, (1.4%)
  ZRareExpectation12 = 16, (1.6%)
  ZRareExpectation11 = 24, (2.4%)
  ZRareExpectation10 = 34, (3.4%)
  ZRareExpectation09 = 46, (4.6%)
  ZRareExpectation08 = 58, (5.8%)
  ZRareExpectation07 = 72, (7.2%)
  ZRareExpectation06 = 88, (8.8%)
  ZRareExpectation05 = 106, (10.6%)
  ZRareExpectation04 = 124, (12.4%)
  ZRareExpectation03 = 144, (14.4%)
  ZRareExpectation02 = 166, (16.6%)
  ZRareExpectation01 = 456, (45.6%)
  ZRareExpectation00 = 1000, (100%, meaning that if all the previous checks fail, the item that dropped will be a junk grey item)

Whenever an item drops, the game rolls for every tier rarity from the highest to the lowest and gives you the item of a tier at which the check first succeeds. Note all the enemies also have a certain parameter called "Danger Class", which further affects the chances. If it's too low, that enemy will pretty much never drop the highest tiers. This includes pretty much all regular enemies. Out of regular enemies, Werewolves and Champion enemies have the highest base danger class. Unfortunately, the math behind how exactly does Danger Class affect the probabilities is not known. My assumption would be that it's something in the vein of:

(Danger Class/Item tier) * ZRareExpectation = actual final Expectation

So if you are killing something that has a danger class of 8, you would do 8/15 and multiply the current chance for tier 15 item by that. Making that 2 into a 1.066.

 

For the base expectations, if you had 300% overall CtFV, you'd go from the top and multiply each number by 3, then substract the difference from the lowest tier. So:

- Probability for tier 15 would become 6, then tier 1 would be reduced by 4 to 452.

- Probability for tier 14 would become 18 and tier 1 would be further reduced by 12 to 440.

and so on until you get through all the tiers. Should tier 1 hit 0 probability before you reach it, then you would start lowering the probability of the tier above.

 

As for map explored, you get 0.1% CtFV for every 0.4% of the map explored (25% at 100%). Survival bonus also improves it, but same as for danger class, the certain values are not known.

That's all I can think of when it comes to drops at the moment.

Edited May 17, 2022 by idbeholdME