belgarathmth

Hello friends, I just spent this weekend working on my shopper Inquisitor, whose sole reason to exist is to find light sabers under the U.S. Fallen Angel rules. After about a dozen or so searches on Google, constantly rewording the search terms, I found this link by Antitrust, which set out the entire system of tiers and breaking points for shoppers. Antitrust's work has revolutionized my Fallen Angel shopper gameplay. I can now forgo +*allskills in favor of more fun and useful stuff, like +*runspeed and +*experience, until the next breakpoint in the system. So my question is, why are Antitrust's bargaining tier tables not presented in the Wiki under "bargaining"? I searched on the Wiki dozens of times looking for this info without finding anything useful. (The regular bargaining tables are useless for U.S. Fallen Angel players looking for light sabers. We need the knowledge of tiers - light sabers are tier 12 - and the breakpoints for those tiers, before we can efficiently shop for our light sabers.) I know that the overwhemling majority of remaining players for Sacred 2 are Europeans or North Americans who have mangaged to obtain (I suspect illegally) Ice and Blood plus the Community Patch, which removes this problem. Am I the only player in North America who is still playing U.S. Fallen Angel and finding it fun? Antitrust, are you still out there, and are you still playing Fallen Angel, or have you also moved to Ice and Blood plus CM? In any event, I think that Antitrust's tables should absolutely be on the Wiki, with a heading that says "for North American players only", or something like that. Ascaron, I weep for your demise before you could support North America, and Cdv, I deplore your greediness in denying distribution rights for Ice and Blood to an entire hemisphere! Surely you could have found a way to profit by releasing those rights! I certainly hope that Sacred 3 is not going to be banned from the U.S.!

Okay, I went to the Wiki and added a small edit under "Staff of Metal Mastery". Feel free to edit it further.

Gogo, thanks for the interest and the help. The wiki link in your post doesn't work for me. It says something about "fatal error - require once admin" and a whole bunch of other stuff I don't understand. I'll try going to the Wiki page directly and see what I can do. I wasn't really trying to discover anything new when I posted about this, I was just having a lot of fun with the staff, and I wanted to share my delight and my perception that it seemed to be playing the Blind Guardian Sacred song. I am fairly certain I have found all the notes it can play - low E, G, A, B, and A-highE. And those notes can be used to make the lines from the song that I have posted above. However, because of the nature of music based on pentatonic scales (played rapidly and randomly it makes lots of melodies by accident), I still cannot be certain that the song fragments I hear are not by coincidence. The guitars (the axe and the sword) seem to work the same way as the microphone. I tested the drumstick with the cymbal-shield, and I didn't hear anything special from them. The guitars make it very hard to hear pitch because of the distort function typical to electric guitar sound. Also, it is very hard to get a good sequence of hits, even when almost every attack is successful, because the enemies run, or get knocked back, or suicide themselves suddenly against damage reflection, and every time that happens, the staff seems to go back to the beginning of its sequence. So, what we have here may still be a myth which has its origins from the nature of music, music theory, and scales; combined with the rapid-fire nature of the notes heard, because of good attack speed; combined with the fact that few players ever spend time with the Blind Guardian weapons due to their relatively low damage output; combined with a lack of documentation from the producers (which you are working on - let's hope they will finally clear this up once and for all). I like to be very, very careful what I put in a source like Wiki, because I respect the process of sharing knowledge. I often say careless, off-the-cuff, and emotion-based things in a forum thread that few will read anyway, but thinking about putting something in a reference source brings out the scholar in me, and I put on my skeptic's cap.

I have an update on this topic. I just spent the last week rebuilding my character with Pole Arms skill maxed, taking everything in strength, so I could more thoroughly test the staff. The staff only has five notes in it: low E, G (rare), A, B, and B-high E (or A-high E?). That's enough notes to play "when(low E)" - "long(G)" - "lost(A)" - "mem(B)" - "or"(A) - "ies re(B(or A?)-high E)" - "turn(B)". also: "fin(B)" - "al(B)" - "hour (B, low E)". also" "all(B)" - "dead(G)" - "and(D, missing)" - "gone (A)". also: "I'm bleed(B-high E) - "ing(B) - "I'm fad(B-high E)- "ing(B)" - "here(low E)" - "in(G)" - "my(A)" - "fin(B)" - "al(B)" - "hour(B-lowE, or maybe A-G, have to listen to the bard again)" You can get "oh(B)" - "it's(B)" - "now(B)" - "or(B)" - "nev(A)" - "er(G)", but you can never get to "we shall stand to-" because there's no C. It's still possible that I and the other people who have played with the instruments have imagined the phenomenon, because the bard's Sacred chorus is in E minor, and the staff plays G pentatonic (missing the D), which sounds like E minor if you put the low E on the bottom. What bugs me and makes me hold onto my idea, though, is that double note on B- or A-high E. Why put that there if the staff is random, when the Sacred verse contains those notes in that rhythm? It seems like too big a coincidence. I don't think it's a good idea to put this idea in the Wiki without certain confirmation. At least, there needs to be an "unconfirmed but reported" caveat in the Wiki entry. In the meantime, I am still having a lot of fun playing with the staff and finding out what it can play.

My, big, huge, one thing I wish I could change gripe: Gender! I want to be a male seraphim. I want to be a male half-elf. There's no good reason other than pure cutting-corners-we-don't-feel-like-making-sprite-models-and-voice-sets-on-two-genders laziness for not having this. And I second the light-dark gripe. Why can't there be an inquisitor of Lumen who genuinely "only wants to help"? Why wouldn't "good" and "evil" characters temporarily unite to fight a common enemy?

Yeah, I like that "Guitar Hero" comparison. After playing with it some more, I'm noticing that the notes seem to start playing out of order the more you miss. The tones only start to arrange themselves into coherent fragments of the melody when I get a whole bunch of hits in a row without missing, and usually it needs me to get some double hits as well as regular hits. To hear its full capability and to find out exactly how much of the melody it plays, I think I will need to master Pole Arms skill and put most of my attribute points into strength, and then get into an area where the enemies are very thick. I also need to get rid of any "chance to fear" items and not practice on rangers, because every time an enemy disengages and runs, the staff seems to count it as a miss and the notes randomize again. If anyone isn't sure of the tune I'm referring to that it tries to play, it's what that bard sings in his tenor voice in all the towns. From what I've heard so far, it never does the notes from "and a voice keeps calling..."; it stops at "long lost memories return"; so far, I mostly hear fragments of "bleeding ... fading ... final hour (tricky because the first three syllables are the same note) ... when long lost (takes a really good sequence of hits to get those three notes)... "memories return". The song is in E minor (or within a half step of that), and the melody does a lot of repeated E's and B's. "I'm (B)... bleed(high E)... ing (B)... I'm (B)... fad (high E)... ing (B) ... here in my (F#,G,A)... final hour (B,B,B,low E)... When long lost (low E, F#, G)... memories (B,B,B)... return (high E, B) Also, since this thread seems to be getting a little more attention than I thought it would, I need to add the disclaimer that I cannot absolutely, 100% confirm that it's really doing what I think it is. So far this is a hypothesis based on my musicianship and my experience playing with the weapon in the game.

I don't know of any videos. Sorry, but I'm not skilled enough with file manipulation to do one myself. Maybe somebody who already knows how to make videos and post them will come along and decide to try it. I also don't know why or how it got Pole Arms skill put into it. Maybe it was by accident during one of the PC patches for Fallen Angel. It looks like a staff and it has "staff" in the name, but it has "Pole Arms +4" in it and it does accept your Pole Arms skill bonuses. (I checked my inventory screen). I'm glad it did though, because I would have probably never tried it if it only worked as a staff. On paper, it looks like a terrible weapon, which is why I never tried it before and why most people probably never do. Anyway, I'm having a great time playing with it and trying to get more notes out of it. Since it plays hit by hit, it mostly plays single notes, but sometimes when there are eighth notes or syncopations in the rhythm of the melody, it plays two of the notes together. It was the positioning of those double notes in the sequence that got me to start realizing what it was playing. That, and I had read a long time ago in another post about someone getting the guitar to play the tune. (I've played a lot with the guitar, and it has such a harsh distort turned on that I never really could hear much melody in it. The clear whistles of the "staff" make much more pure pitch and make it much easier to identify pitch.) It helps to start to perceive the melody if you activate a combat art like Frenzied Rampage, because that gets you more notes played without pauses in between. Hearing it is a lot like staring at those old 3-D prints with the color splashes that were popular in the 80's. Some people could see the picture and some people couldn't. (I never could.) It's probably the same way with this staff. You have to have a really good musical ear with a strong melodic perception before you start to get it; at first it just sounds like random notes, and if you miss a lot it starts to do an electronic feedback squeal that kind of punishes you for missing. I'm having a lot of fun with it.

Well, this game continues to surprise me. I'm playing this week with my first Pole Arms Shadow Warrior with Astral Lord aspect; he's up to about level 33. Tonight, I noticed that the Staff of Metal Mastery from the Blind Guardian quest has a Pole Arms modifier in it, so I decided to try it. I couldn't believe this - it actually whistles the Sacred song hit by hit. "I'm ... bleed .. ing ... I'm ... fad ... ing ... here...in ... my .. .fi ... nal ... hour" It gets through the whole line if you don't miss, but starts all over if you miss or run out of enemies to hit. It often doesn't reset and starts in the middle of the phrase when you start in on a new mob, making it very tricky to hear the tune. You have to have a high attack bonus before you will begin to hear it. Over and over, hit by hit, it plays the tune. I think I'll keep using this weapon all the way through Silver until I can get the next one in Gold, even though it will become outdated in its damage potential rather soon. Maybe I'll switch to something stronger for bosses, but for trash mobs, this weapon is just too much fun! I can't get the siren's call of that whistling out of my head! How delightful! It's kind of a weird weapon - it responds to Pole Arms skill, but it also has an Armor Lore based speed boost. Does anyone know if it responds to Magic Staff skill?

Okay, so I came home on my lunch break today and ran the purchase again. I just got home from work, logged onto my account at DLGamer, and it says "cancelled - refunded to PayPal". Oh well, I'm ready to just let this go now. Thank you all for trying to help me.

Gogo - thanks for interceding. They refunded my original purchase promptly, so we're even at this point. Are you saying I should run the purchase again? If something goes wrong, I'd just wind up having to ask for a refund all over again. How can I know it would work this time? Are you saying they put some kind of marker on my account there so they'll get it and process it if I do it again?

Okay, I decided to go for it. I paid DLGamer via Paypal, then got the "your transaction has been blocked for security reasons" at the website. I opened a dispute with Paypal.

Thanks for the tea and sympathy, everybody. @Elwin, yeah, I don't care to play hardcore, because having a character file erased and destroyed after having spent tens or even hundreds of hours working on the build and the equipment strikes me as just too devastating. I bet it really gets the adrenaline pumping when you know you're about to face a boss, though - for those who are thrillseekers, I guess that intense fear is what it's all about. But still, the game manages to penalize you very heavily for death through the survival bonus. Tonight, I decided I wanted to play an old shadow warrior save (hammer build), so I could feel strong again. I was running around the desert on silver at about level 42 or so, one-shotting every creature and not even taking any damage. Got overconfident, went up against Garganthropod, dead shadow warrior, back to level 0 SB. <sigh>. Oh well, I was fast tracking this guy to gold and not taking any side-quests or anything, so I guess I'll just go on to gold without caring about the SB, give myself a fresh start in gold, and take some time to "smell the flowers" and do sidequests and stuff.

I just lost an 80% survival bonus on my 60th level inquisitor against the cursed Fourth Nameless Guardian. All the way through silver without a single death, and I die right at the end, on the very last fight! I made the mistake of trying to activate my so-called "god power" instead of sitting on the potion button and keeping my eye glued to my health bar. Now I get to play gold with everybody yellow and at my level, instead of red and nine levels above me like they should be. As the Peanuts say, AUGH!

I love the Gregorian Chant in the inquisitor's battle music. I started out playing a shadow warrior, and his music is rather bland by comparison. The first time I played an inquisitor, I was surprised and delighted to hear the chanting and the low horn simulating a church bell. I've never played a seraphim, because I have trouble identifying with a female toon - I like to pretend that's me in there. But I may have to try one just to hear the music. Does she have any organ music like on Seraphim Isle? What other characters have unique sounds in their soundtracks?

@Wolfie and Schot, Thanks so much for the fast and detailed replies. I am definitely going to need to refer to your instructions and follow step by step if and when I do the upgrade. Right now, though, I'm really enjoying playing my current inquisitor, and based on what you two say, I'm pretty sure I will have to start all over with new characters if I want to do Ice and Blood. So I'll probably wait until I'm thoroughly bored with my inquisitor(s) and shadow warrior(s) and have nothing to lose before I uninstall my current version. I'm not at all familiar with registries and the like, and the processes you describe for making the change are a little bit intimidating to me. I can probably get it done when I have time to devote to it, but as I recall, the Sacred 2 installation process takes a long, long time - It took overnight to install the last time, and that was without a long download beforehand. Also, it tends to have a lot of tech problems that take a while to research and fix. I would see it as a gamble of $40, at least a day of my free time, and a whole lot of potential headaches, in exchange for the possibility of getting to try the dragon mage and two new areas. I might get in trouble with activating and deactivating security keys, or hidden files on my Windows 7, and wind up with nothing playable at all. I've also heard that the company that sells this product likes to do customer service and tech help by text message, and I don't have texting service. So for now, I'd better go with "if it ain't broke, I'd better not fix it." But again, thank you so much for the help and instructions. I will definitely refer back to these posts if I change my mind later. The Dark Matters community really impresses me with its friendliness, helpfulness, and welcoming nature.

Hello, I'm currently playing U.S. Fallen Angel, and I'm considering using the Dark Matters link to download and switch to U.K. Ice and Blood, because I'd like to try the Dragon Mage. I have some questions: Would I need to uninstall my current U.S. version of Sacred 2 before installing the new U.K version? Would I lose all my saved characters and equipment (light sabers!) Is it possible to keep both versions installed in different folders such that I could switch back easily if I didn't like Ice and Blood? Thanks.

Hello, I am playing the single player, pre-Ice and Blood US version of Sacred2. It is very polished and generally operates very well, but one consistent problem I have is with the worldmap. After a certain number of times opening and closing it, it eventually goes either partially drawn or totally blank. Once this happens, I have to totally shut the game down and restart in order to fix it. The game client will usually crash with its error message. Sometimes I get back to the main menu, sometimes not (black screen). But even if the game gets back to its main menu, if I restart from there, the worldmap will still be corrupted. Quite often I have to ctrl-alt-del the windows task manager and end task that way in order to get my desktop back. The only sure method of restoring normalcy is to completely quit to desktop and/or end task and then restart the game. It's not totally unbearable, but it's awfully inconvenient, since I like to consult the worldmap rather frequently. Is there any change I might make in the game configuration that would eliminate this problem?

'Got a new red and a new blue tonight. The red was obtained in an orc village immediately after finishing the last subquest there (which took me a real time hour or more running around for miles and miles in the orc region - I think it was the one about finding "gooey" kobold and goblin organs to cook into an orc delicacy.) The blue one was obtained on Seraphim Island immediately after completing the subquest where you have to gather all the elemental essences for research. I had also done the pumpkin seeds debacle. I would say that there is definitely a potential lightsaber reward through the merchants when the player has done the equivalent of "pacifying" a region, as in Sacred 1. Incidentally, my latest lightsaber finds are starting to exceed even the best gold and orange/unique swords in power. They have huge native conversion to elemental damage; the green, blue, and purple ones have huge attack and defense bonuses, as well as deathblow and aspect bonuses; the red ones have lifeleech, bleed, wound, banish undead, and aspect bonuses. They all have one or two other random bonuses besides the big ones, and many of them have extra slots. They all get the attack speed of one-handed swords and can be dual-wielded, even though they're technically two-handed swords in the original Star Wars lore. If your shopper passes on one to your shadow warrior, I assume that he would be able to use a shield together with the lightsaber. Bottom line: lightsabers rock!

ROFL! Hilarious! Isn't that the same guys who made the parking garage lightsaber fight video? @S-P: Bargaining doesn't have to be twice your level, but it does look like it needs to be kept above your level. I don't know the exact probability curve, but I'm not taking any chances - I keep my bargaining maxed and give priority to items with +to all skills or +bargaining. Collecting lightsabers becomes a full time character strategy, because you have to make some sacrifices in other areas. You do it because you love the video and sound effects, and the Star Wars connection, not because you want to make an uebercharacter. Good to know, but my 26 level seraphim has now got bargaining at 20 points above level through relics/plus all skill items. I've only found the one sabre in Thylysium, no luck anywhere else. But I'm going to get more, its got to have a certain amount of luck involved. I read a tip in the older thread about this topic (a little further down the board - somebody bumped it) that said the writer thought that doing most of the subquests in an area would increase the chances of special offers from the merchants in that area. My own experience bears this out. I've been doing most of the subquests to get my Inquisitor to a fairly high level for silver just because he needs to be. I'm finding him more fun to play but not nearly as strong and safe as all my Shadow Warrior characters, who can finish silver ten levels lower than my Inquisitor has needed just to be survivable in the orc region. Subjectively, I do think I am finding lots of light sabers in the areas where I've done most of the subquests. When I first arrived in the orc region last night, I was finding pretty junky stuff at the merchants, so I took a tour through the portal system, went back all around the high elf and human regions, and came up with a new purple. It does seem to get a little harder to find light sabers as you get to higher and higher levels. Doing all the subquests seems to help.

ROFL! Hilarious! Isn't that the same guys who made the parking garage lightsaber fight video? @S-P: Bargaining doesn't have to be twice your level, but it does look like it needs to be kept above your level. I don't know the exact probability curve, but I'm not taking any chances - I keep my bargaining maxed and give priority to items with +to all skills or +bargaining. Collecting lightsabers becomes a full time character strategy, because you have to make some sacrifices in other areas. You do it because you love the video and sound effects, and the Star Wars connection, not because you want to make an uebercharacter.

I've played last night and tonight - I've found two blues, two reds, a purple, and a green. I lost one red because I didn't have enough money when I saw it. LIghtsabers are a "special offer" from a merchant, and if you don't buy it as soon as you see it, I.e., you close the merchant window, it will not be there again. I'm starting to think based on what I'm reading that lightsabers are much harder to come by for Ice and Blood players. I'm playing the U.S. version without Ice and Blood, and I am having no problem getting them. It's easy to get relics with +2, +3, and then +4 to bargaining skill. Do I understand correctly that the relics in Ice and Blood don't have such large bonuses? I wonder if the whole bargaining skill might have gotten gimped in Ice and Blood? My new green has +28% opponent level for death blow! I'm finding lightsabers with life leech, banish undead, -regen for Inquisitor Aspects, you name it. I love my new green, because it matches the aura color for Reverse Polarity. I'm also finding boohoodles of set items by equipping +% to find valuables, and opening up map and doing subquests. Lots of inquisitor set items have beautiful red, green, and gold hues, which blend marvelously with red and green lightsabers together with Reverse Polarity. I've also tried blue and purple lightsabers with white and gold robes for a more "angelic/seraphimic" look - almost like being a male seraphim when I care to swing that way. I'm having a blast! I don't know how much difference Ice and Blood makes, or playing in multiplayer as opposed to single player like I play, but my strategy is to max bargaining, plus to all skills, plus to find valuables, and taking my time uncovering map and doing sidequests. I am getting a growing colllection of way-cool lightsabers this way. Oh, also, I am not dual-wielding, but rather, I am pumping Sword Weapons skill. Could that make a difference in the program? My toon swings his one lightsaber so fast it makes a blur of color and sound. I hope maybe this helps someone.

Okay, my friends, this is crazy! I think I've died and gone to Lidsville, except now it's Lightsabersville. <"Sabersville is the kook-kook-kookiest, Sabersville is the ook-ook-ookiest, ... if you ever go-go-go-go there, you'll be glad you did, 'cause, everyone who goes to Sabersville reallly flips his lid!" cue Charles Nelson Riley as Hoodoo cackling "Hoohahahoo! How's that for a topper! Hoohahahoo!" > I just played tonight and found three, count them, THREE, freakin' lightsabers at the traders in Thylysium! I've now got two blues and two reds! The new ones all have an extra slot for rings or blacksmith arts, one of the reds has Chance to Banish Undead, and the other red has Life Leech! OMG, this is going to be fun! My ears keep having freakin' orgasms from that sub-bass electronic thumping when my lightsabers hit! Thruumm! Thoom! Thoom! OMG, baby, yes, yes! Mechanics for those who are interested: Level 19 Inquisitor on silver; 33 Bargaining through maxed skill points, runes, and items of +2 general skills; chance to find valuables 19%. It may be making a difference that I am taking my time through silver and doing most of the subquests. I expect to be way too high a level for gold by the time I get there - probably level 60-70 plus. My plan is to rush through the main quest on gold and hopefully be balanced again by the time I get to platinum. It may also matter that I am an American playing pre-Ice-and-Blood Sacred2. I will never play IandB unless it gets released in an American version that doesn't involve hacking the program and the licenses involved. ASIDE: I am playing my first darkside character, and loving that I can follow my own moral compass. I help the poor, combat crime, and reject sidequests that reek of evil, like assasinations or unjustified thefts. I have no intention of destroying the T-energy generator left to us by the Ancients. @Wolfie RE Bob the Inquisitor at the Lightsabers Anonymous meeting: ROFLMAO! Hilarious! Priceless! @Ryan RE Exhibit A: <gulp> Is it too late for a plea bargain?

ROFLMAO! ROFLMAO! Maybe I'll have to go to rehab for lightsaber addicts! EDIT: Thanks for the video! I saw it from one of my research threads, and it's what convinced me that I absolutely MUST have a Sacred2 lightsaber! I am so geeking out over this find!

It sounds like the devs are politically liberal, environmental, New-Agey types who are using this story with T-energy as an allegory for nuclear energy. I prefer the third option that I will make up in my head. Science is good when used for the good, science is bad when used for the bad, and religion is very limiting and usually bad. I guess my own personality would be technically "darkside" from the Sacred2 writers' point of view, but I would use the repaired T-energy to advance civilization, not destroy it. I look forward to seeing how the so-called "darkside" story plays out with my new Inquisitor. The battle between Lumen and Ker is a child's battle against another; Testa is the true "god", and even moreso because he would be the first super-powered Ancient to reject the title! Science is good. Religion is bad. EDIT: This whole story archetype (far from an original one) puts me in mind of the Gou'a'ould from the Stargate series! Right down to the "stargate" map portals and the "Jaffa" Temple Guardians!

Hooray! After long weeks of researching the topic and figuring out how to get one, I FINALLY got my first lightsaber tonight! <cue Handel's Hallelujah Chorus> <singing> Hallelujah! Hallelujah! Hallelujah----Hallelujah! Halle-e-lu-jah! For--the-Lord-God-omnipotent-reign-----eth!" <ahem> Uh, so anyway, it's blue, and I'm SOOOOOoooooo happy! I swear, I'm almost crying for joy! Yay! Yay! Yay! And the sound effect is so incredibly awesome! I turned up the bass on my amplifier to max, and I swear, it makes the room shake on every hit with that orgasmic bass hum! I will never want to play Sacred 2 again without a light saber! This one's only level 14, so I hope I find more! For anyone who's still interested in the mechanics of this topic, I am using an Inquisitor with Bargaining maxed. I found the lightsaber with only level 20 in Bargaining with a level 13 character, so it's not true that Bargaining has to be twice your level. It may make a difference that I am giving priority to equipping items with a +% to find valuables. I may have just gotten an incredibly lucky one-in-a-thousand diceroll, but I hope not. Time will tell. Drinks on me for the whole forum! <singing> Hallelujah! Hallelujah! <laughing and smiling, filled with joy> Isn't it wonderful that a game can be so good as to cause such high emotion?