Optimizing spell damage

[chattius 2,533]

Weapon damage is calculated like (not 100% sure of all parts, but no example that it isn't so)

 

1. 
    
   
2. base weapon damage
   
3. add damage x-x rings
   
4. add base weapon damage from certain combat arts (the ones with et_weapondamage_ in spells.txt)
   
5. apply direct damage (from items and combat arts(the ones with et_mult_weapondamage in spells.txt)
   
6. apply x% damage to the different damage types (items, buffs, combat arts, tactics, combat discipline, ...)
   
7. apply criticals (items, buff, combat art)
   
8. add the damage shown in the stat window
   
9. apply damage type converters
   
10. apply deathblow
    

 

So with damage x-x rings very early in the formula Kungfu dryads like the Waffenmeisterin are playable if you socket enough damage x-x rings to replace the missing weapon.

 

I never played pure casters to test it, so I think that direct spell damage is like:

1. 
    
   
2. add base spell damage from the combat art
   
3. apply x% damage to the different damage types (items, buffs, combat arts, ancient magic, combat discipline, ...)
   
4. apply criticals (items, buff, combat art)
   
5. add the damage shown in the stat window
   
6. apply deathblow (not Ice and Blood)
   

 

 

Weapon based Magic coup combat art:

entry0 = {"et_mult_weapondamage", 1200, 2, 0, 9 },

entry1 = {"et_AW_rel", 500, 20, 0, 5 },

entry2 = {"et_baseAW", 200, 350, 0, 5 },

entry3 = {"et_damage_any_rel", 400, 100, 0, 5 },

entry4 = {"et_physical_to_magic", 500, 20, 0, 5 },

entry5 = {"et_chance_surehit", 300, 2, 1, 5 },

entry6 = {"et_mult_weapondamage", 200, 1, 2, 9 },

entry7 = {"et_life_leech", 50, 50, 3, 9 },

entry8 = {"et_energy_leech_whit", 95, 5, 4, 5 },

entry9 = {"et_chance_criticalhit", 200, 2, 5, 5 },

entry10 = {"et_chance_areasplash", 500, 5, 6, 5 }

It has 'Direct damage' as in entry0+6 and x% damage as in entry3. But it has no base damage.

 

Cobalt strike spell:

entry0 = {"et_dotdam_TC_mag", 1120, 560, 0, 42 },

entry1 = {"et_spelldamage_magic", 630, 315, 0, 133 },

entry2 = {"et_spelldamage_physical", 350, 175, 0, 133 },

entry3 = {"et_spelldamage_magic", 310, 155, 1, 133 },

entry4 = {"et_chance_chain_nr", 800, 1, 2, 4 },

entry5 = {"et_chance_electrify", 400, 4, 3, 5 },

entry6 = {"et_chance_chain_nr", 800, 1, 4, 4 },

entry7 = {"et_chance_areasplash", 500, 5, 5, 5 },

entry8 = {"et_chance_criticalhit", 99, 1, 6, 5 },

It has base damage as in entries1,2+3. But it seems spells don't get any multiplayer like direct damage and spells don't have any x% damage build into the combat art.

 

So what would be best:

Raising the base damage by higher ca-levels or working on the x% damage part which is not in the combat art entries. Base damage would be pumping focus while x% damage would be pumping the lore. I was always too lazy to do the equatations and I preferred to go for highest possible ca-levels by playing hybrids who recharged spells with regeneration per hit. For example a fire-elf with 2 fire buffs for x% damage part and using magic coup for the recharging.

 

But how to optimize a pure mage who won't use regeneration per hit. Late game half regeneration time items stack well enough to reach 100%. But what would be better reducing the regeneration time to have higher base damage because of higher level Combat Arts or to raise the x% damage and keep the ca-level low?

 

For a weapon fighter you can reduce the number of damage x-x rings the higher your weapon damage already is (two-handed hammer).

Edited April 28, 2011 by chattius

[Llama8 8]

Argh, I did have a reply typed out that got eaten.

 

Long story short, some spells (not many & several of them are buffs) get +% damage to specific elements, either as part of the base CA or from a mod. As to what's the "best" way of increasing damage, that'll likely be heavily dependant on your level & your gear (in terms of +CA, +Focus/Lore & +% damage) as to whether you'll get more effect from increasing a CA level (which end game will likely be above your Max CA level anyway) or increasing your Lore/+% damage.

[chattius 2,533]

I added a poll, I allways wanted to learn how to do them.

 

The question is not about the character with the best magic damage. The question is which character is best to learn optimizing magical damage. So it shouldn't be too easy on one side but on the other side it shouldn't be impossible to play the character as a mage.

 

In memories of my singing barbarian from Diablo2, I was considering to try the :)impossible:): playing a shadow warrior just with spells - probably starting with gold, hybrid early game.

 

I hope to get knowledge in magical damage is calculated, how it is best optimized and have some fun(very important factor).

 

But is the shadow warrior the best to test this: he has not much spells. So you can't test many aspects of different spell forms in a single character. My time is very limited and I probably will do what I hate: do speed leveling with a factor 5 or 10.

 

So all you magic users around (as I wrote I never did a pure magic char before in sacred2) vote and perhaps add a note why you would try this character class to learn optimizing spell damage.

[Llama8 8]

If you want to do a "caster" SW, you'd be limited to the following CAs: Ruinous Onslaught, Rousing Command (though it would only boost the regen of CAs if you take the appropriate mod), the buffs, Killing Spree, Augmenting Guidon (for defence & HP regen, with the appropriate mods), Belligerent Vault & possibly the summoning CAs from Astral Lord.

 

That is a decent number of CAs, but only RO, Killing Spree (kinda) & Vault would do any damage to opponents (unless you want to use the summoning CAs). I think a pure caster SW would definitely be a challenge, more so since he doesn't get Ancient Magic for a further damage boost.

[chattius 2,533]

In ice and blood the SW would have ancient magic. I allways wondered how killing spree would be used.

[Llama8 8]

The wiki needs to be updated then...

I've never really understood how KS works properly, I'm not sure if the damage it does is related at all to the amount of weapon damage you're doing (as the description implies/states), since I don't think I've ever had more than two pulses & I've usually been too busy to note how much damage the pulse does (to see if it's getting a damage bonus from the weapon damage you're doing).

 

Edit: As to the poll, if you can make the SW a caster, anyone can be a caster...

[claudius 104]

Killing spree does terrible damage. Even with 200 runes. Skeletal fortification is the only good damage dealing spell. It is kinda slow against bosses. Killing spree can be modded to raise attack speed and chance to hit very big increase. A substitute for rallied command if you don't have death warrior. Buffing to hit boss.

Edited April 28, 2011 by claudius

[chattius 2,533]

What seems to be bad at shadow warrior mages:

Physical damage only - ancient magic seems to break only damage mitigation but not high physical resists. Using physical attacks with reduce armour modifiers would no longer be a pure shadow mage.

Shadow mages must be played as 2.5 aspects builds, so 7 skills are already planed: 2 focus/lore, ancient magic, combat discipline, concentration, ...

A jump does less damage than an exploding fireball at a bigger execution time.

Fortifications are nice to play if instantly recharged with reg per hit - as a pure shadow mage even with 100% chance to halve regeneration times, you will have 1-2 towers less than a hybrid.

Only one dam,age type demands that you bring ancient magic to mastery quickly ,so developing the 2nd aspect will be delayed to around level 90+.

Edited May 2, 2011 by chattius

[chattius 2,533]

Using jolting touch to recharge spells with mana leech modifier?

 

Jolting touch can reach around 17% mana leech at ca-level 100

 

Regeneration times: are they calculated in this order?

Combat art level and read runes define regeneration time

buff penalty multiplay to this time

-regeneration time lowers it

stamina makes what?

 

if all this is calculated:

 

if in a combination combat discipline lowers the regeneration time calculated so far by 10/20%.

chance to halve regeneration times (if successful turns the clock to six)

regeneration starts with begin of animation

mana leech spells (advances the clock by the give amount) after hit animation

 

 

So a deadly spears which reads 5 seconds regeneration and is in a combination with jolting touch with a 15% mana leech:

 

combat discipline mastery will reduce it to 4s

100 % chance to half regeneration time cuts it down to 2s

now the animations are done (let's say they take 1s)

so we are now at 1s regeneration time left and from this 1s mana leech will remove 0.15 seconds

so 0.85 s have to be regenerated

 

A deadly spears which reads 10 seconds regeneration and is in a combination with jolting touch with a 15% mana leech:

combat discipline mastery will reduce it to 8s

100 % chance to half regeneration time cuts it down to 4s

now the animations are done (let's say they take 1s)

so we are now at 3s regeneration time left and from this 3s mana leech will remove 0.45 seconds

so 2.55s have to be regenerated

 

In my feeling taking the mana leech modification for the jolting touch seems to be a waste, because it kicks in after a successful hit and last in the calculation. Jolting touch can't replace regeneration per hit in a self-recharging combination.

Edited May 4, 2011 by chattius

[Llama8 8]

I thought the RpH on Jolting Touch was an absolute modifier (since it doesn't have "_rel" as part of the token name, rather than a % modifier? And it's per pulse, so at level 1 (with the mod chosen for a total of 0.7s, or 7%, or whatever it is), it would give a total of 3 pulses for 3x whatever it regenerates.

[chattius 2,533]

"et_energy_leech_once"

 

I thought this too, but: JT at ca-level 100 has a duration of more than 5s, a leech of 17% and 1.34 ticks per second: one JT with 5 17% ticks should recharge fully in 5 seconds. Sadly it seems to be not this way.

 

Looks like only the first JT-tick counts for the mana leech.

 

The mana-leech inquisitor spell can reach more than 100% mana leech and instantly recharge a combination without need for reg per hit.

Edited May 4, 2011 by chattius