Synnworld 11 Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 (edited) So, something crossedmy mind for the first time while playing, what racebis the dragon mage? For the most part, the races seem obvious, high elf, dryadld, and inquisitor are elves, TG is a android, SW a human,and seraphim a celestial. Do what are Dragon mages, human? Elf? Mixture of whoever can press dragons? This question crossed my mind after just receiving a quest to capture some fun away slaves. Despite the fact I'm walking the path of light (I hope there is a option to free them, I've barely ran into any quest with choices.) I originally assumed DM was human due to the lack of pointy ears, and asking a human to enslave another in a world were humans isn't the dominant ruling class, yea like I'm going to do that. Edit, DM also lack the facial structure of SW which I simply wrote off as lack of physical training. Edited May 17, 2015 by Synnworld 1 Link to comment
Flix 5,116 Posted May 17, 2015 Share Posted May 17, 2015 (edited) The game's scripts classify him as human. The rounded human ears seem to back this up. His model is based on the Shadow Warrior which further accounts for the similarity. However, he acts very much like an elf in the game. If you listen to his commentary when receiving the mission to the human realm, and when he kills human-type enemies, he seems to consider himself not human, or at least above and beyond any of them. Also, all other dragon mages (dragon cultists) in the game are elves. It's really never said in any of the official lore. I put him on the elves page on the wiki for these reasons. It was also before I knew about race classification in itemtype.txt. Questions of race aren't always that clear in Sacred 2. The game scripts classify the people in the desert as humans, but the lore book on the Bengaresh Desert clearly says they're descendants of elves that adapted to the climate (like Dryads, which interestingly are classified as a separate race in the scripts). Also FYI in the scripts Seraphim are classified as humans as well, and the Shadow Warrior is classified as Undead, so take the technical classifications with whatever gravity you see fit. Roleplaying reasons may trump technical reasons if you're not modding or keeping close tabs on your racial damage +% modifiers. Edited May 17, 2015 by Flix 1 Link to comment
Popular Post Silver_fox 397 Posted May 17, 2015 Popular Post Share Posted May 17, 2015 Well, if asking one human to enslave another seems strange to you, then what about asking a Seraphim to do it? I mean the Seraphims are considered to be noble warriors of light, and one would suppose a holy warrior should be irritated by such ignoble request. And yet the guy who offers this quest would offer it to everybody regardless of appearance. He probably just thinks that all wandering adventurers are rogue outcasts who only care about the money and that his money is as good as everybody else's. If you are playing a Light Path char, you quickly prove him wrong by demonstrating that some adventurers do put morals above the money. By the way, it seems to be a common attitude among Tyr Lysia questgivers - if you are playing the Dryad you even have some people openly assume that you are adventuring due to being unfit to stay home and treat you as a renegade. As for the Dragon Mage - there are several characters who are openly called "Dragon Mages" in game. The playable character appears to be human (round ears, sturdy body and so on), and, as Flix said, is formally classified as such. Three other Dragon Mages he encounters during his quest (Gemblik, Fangil and nameless Dragon Mage Adept you find on the road) share the human appearance with the playable character, and the fourth (Varmin) is a definite High Elf. On the other hand these characters do not ever call themselves anything other than the Dragon Mages, and put a lot of value in being chosen and mentored by the Dragons. We are never told how the Dragons choose their apprentices, so it might be that there are Dragon Mages who belong to different races, and the different look of the guys encountered during the Dragon Mage's class quest seems to support this theory. From the journal entries and spoken comments, the playable Dragon Mage appears to be rather sarcastic and looking down on pretty much everybody except for Dragons. He is not kind toward humans, but his remarks on the High Elves he meets during his class quest are no better, and let us not start on goblinoids. So it appears that being a Dragon Mage is a cultural thing - their race is secondary if it matters at all. The Dragon Cultists of the Dragon Sea Islands are Elves for sure, but they are never actually called Dragon Mages. They are described as "dragon worshipers" and appear to be the servants of the Dragons but it is never mentioned that the Dragons teach them anything or see much value in them at all. They never use much magic, preferring to attack with polearms. From the quest about the conspiracy within the cult we learn that the leaders of the cult are conning their subordinates and only want to rob them of their money, so they are probably charlatans and there might not be any real Dragon Magic behind the cult at all. Then again, some of the cultists - certainly not all of them - might be actual Dragon Mages. In the end it's up to the player whether or not to think of the Dragon cult and the Dragon Mages as related groups. The game leaves room for both opinions. One more angle that might be worth considering is that there are two locations themed around Dragons and their followers - the Island in the Jade Sea where the playable character starts and the caves under the Dragon Sea Islands. In the first place you meet a couple of human-looking Dragon Mages, and the second one is populated by elven Dragon Cult. So it's possible that the southern Dragons choose their apprentices from some human tribe, and the northern Dragons from the elven cultists. My personal opinion is that the playable Dragon Mage is technically (biologically) human, but he renounced his origin when he was chosen to be apprenticed with the Dragons. Now that his study is complete, he considers himself a superior being and would be offended if someone bundles him up with the commoners of Artamark who never had an honor to talk to a Dragon let alone study from one. Then again, the Sacred 2 lore is a bunch of confusing and mutually contradicting texts - you can read rather different descriptions of the world, its races and events depending on which character you play and which path you follow - so every player can make everything he wishes out of it. 2 Link to comment
Synnworld 11 Posted May 17, 2015 Author Share Posted May 17, 2015 It was more for the "Artist" reasons, and some roleplaying reasons. I tend to have a habit od putting myself in RPG skyrim (redguard destruction wizards represent!) Shadowrun (Human Mage/shaman) and in sacred it would only be the dragon mage or SW, I really don't like elves that much. I don't hate them, but they aren't my favorite race. Also I've been having the urge to do some fan art, and depending on whether or not I added dialogue, I needed to know the DM race. 1 Link to comment
LilaGrey 56 Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 (edited) The races, in Sacred 2, are very confused..I mean, the Inquisitor should be an HighElf, but if you remove his starting/placeholder equipment, you see that his ears are rounded, not pointed...and he's not slim and small as all of the high elf's, he's quit tall, whit a big chest (not visible removing starting equipment, but it's notable)The Seraphims should be a mystical race from another dimension (as I read somewhere), and if I'm not mistaken they can not age, but are classified as human....This is one of the many inaccuracies in the Sacred's mythology...I'd like to know something more precise about the various races in the game Edited May 18, 2015 by LilaGrey Link to comment
Synnworld 11 Posted May 18, 2015 Author Share Posted May 18, 2015 (edited) I thought the inquisitor were dark elves, notcgigh elves and I called seraphim celestial because I read that the were born from the blood of the goddess ofcwar after she died. Edited May 18, 2015 by Synnworld Link to comment
Flix 5,116 Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 (edited) The game only has one elf classification and that's "highelf", so both the Inquisitor and the High Elf get that classifications. Likewise there's no separate classification for Seraphim, probably because they're not an enemy in the game, so the Seraphim are humans in the scripts. You only know this if you look at the scripts though. In terms of lore, yes, I like to think the Inquisitors became the Dark Elves while the High Elves became Wood Elves of Sacred 1. If you want to brush up on the lore of Sacred 2 some official stuff is here: Backstory Anyways, you can't take appearances too seriously. The game even uses some of the same models for both humans and high elves. For example, the human cult mages are identical to the inquisitor NPC's, just with a different robe texture, and a different race classification in the scripts. Edited May 18, 2015 by Flix Link to comment
NathyielNathyiel 45 Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 Maybe Human and Elf are linked in some way (evolution). That could explain High Elf attitude : they think they're better because they style have the pointy ears. Racial purity, etc. Link to comment
Synnworld 11 Posted May 18, 2015 Author Share Posted May 18, 2015 That back story is different from what I read about sacred one. Its obvious that the sacred universe is a multiverse, so is sacred 1 and 2 two different universes. http://www.sacredwiki.org/index.php/Sacred:History_%26_Mythology 1 Link to comment
Flix 5,116 Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 Yeah. The history and mythology of Ancaria is completely different between the two games. It's meant to be the same world though. Think of it as a retcon. Link to comment
Synnworld 11 Posted May 18, 2015 Author Share Posted May 18, 2015 Based on what I just saw of the regular wiki page, fallen Angel is a prequel to sacred 1 set 2000 years in the past. Link to comment
LilaGrey 56 Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 there's no separate classification for Seraphim, probably because they're not an enemy in the game, so the Seraphim are humans in the scripts. so Seraphim NEVER appear as a enemy in the game? I ask 'cause I never played the ShadowPath by far... Link to comment
Synnworld 11 Posted May 18, 2015 Author Share Posted May 18, 2015 there's no separate classification for Seraphim, probably because they're not an enemy in the game, so the Seraphim are humans in the scripts. so Seraphim NEVER appear as a enemy in the game? I ask 'cause I never played the ShadowPath by far...I just started a hardcore inquisitor, goi g to try a full mage build, but I would assume he'd have to fight at least 1 of them. Link to comment
Flix 5,116 Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 (edited) so Seraphim NEVER appear as a enemy in the game? I ask 'cause I never played the ShadowPath by far... There's only one, at the very end in the Great Machine (shadow path only). There's also a possible Seraphim fight with the CM Patch, but that is basically fan content, not anything the developers made. Edited May 18, 2015 by Flix 1 Link to comment
Synnworld 11 Posted May 18, 2015 Author Share Posted May 18, 2015 (edited) so Seraphim NEVER appear as a enemy in the game? I ask 'cause I never played the ShadowPath by far... There's only one, at the very end in the Great Machine (shadow path only). There's also a possible Seraphim fight with the CM Patch, but that is basically fan content, not anything the developers made. Which leads me to another question, do all characters follow the same story path in light and shadow stories, or do they branch off after a certain point? I want to know if I beat the game with my light DM, is there a point in doing the main storyline again with my light high elf or seraphim; or should I just run off and do their own stories while committing vast genocide. Edited May 18, 2015 by Synnworld Link to comment
Flix 5,116 Posted May 18, 2015 Share Posted May 18, 2015 The main campaign is the same for every character of a certain alignment. Although the Inquisitor and Seraphim are a bit special, because I'm pretty sure Sophia recognizes the Seraphim for what she is and talks her differently than other Light characters. Likewise the Grand Inquisitor talks to the Inquisitor differently than other Shadow characters. Ultimately though, these are just superficial changes. Character class quests are also different according to alignment (except Dragon Mage which is identical, literally the same quest scripts, probably due to lack of development time). So the personal story of the Light High Elf plays out differently than a Shadow High Elf. This means even if the Light path campaign is old news to you, the Light-path character quests for other characters may have more to offer. I prefer most of the character stories to the main quest anyway (with the exception of the Dryad, who has a jumbled mess of non-related quests). Link to comment
Popular Post wolfie2kX 528 Posted May 19, 2015 Popular Post Share Posted May 19, 2015 In my epic length story (which I'm sorry, I haven't had time to finish), "Sophia's Choice" - I kinda handle that discrepancy rather handily.. True Dragon Mages are reincarnated dragons. Dragons have a rather LONG life cycle and when one dies, it's soul reincarnates normally into another dragon. But since they came to Ancaria, many died but had not had a chance to do that as dragons only mate once every 10,000 years. And so, the dragon souls wound up attached to any body they could find - humans, elves, etc.. Given Dragons DO have an aire of superiority over humans, elves, and other denizens of Ancaria, it's not surprising that Dragon Mages would be a bit uppity toward their own species. If you look at the Sacred 2 logo found in the game - there are two dragon heads - which gives you an idea on who is really in charge on Ancaria... 2 Link to comment
NathyielNathyiel 45 Posted May 19, 2015 Share Posted May 19, 2015 The logo represent 2 dragon head and 2 seraphin wings. Link to comment
Synnworld 11 Posted May 19, 2015 Author Share Posted May 19, 2015 The logo represent 2 dragon head and 2 seraphin wings.So basically the seraphim and dragons got together to have a baby named "Dragon Mage." New head connon activated. 1 Link to comment
NathyielNathyiel 45 Posted May 19, 2015 Share Posted May 19, 2015 The logo represent 2 dragon head and 2 seraphin wings. So basically the seraphim and dragons got together to have a baby named "Dragon Mage." New head connon activated. Why not ;-) More seriously, we don't know orign of the race. But we know that Seraphin like to experiment. Link to comment
wolfie2kX 528 Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 The logo represent 2 dragon head and 2 seraphin wings.So basically the seraphim and dragons got together to have a baby named "Dragon Mage." New head connon activated. Er. That makes little sense.... If you read the book that came from Sacred 1 - The Book of the Seraphim, And I quote.. "Memorandum from Urisa'N TachYon regarding the use of cloned warriors: The first test run in the defense matrix GT-AS 565 went entirely satisfactory. The DNA morphing of Dragon Battle Lizards with female Elifa slaves produced effective fighting amazons in a very short time. These warriors can be used in combat against the three-dimensional giant Worgarians as a replenishable battlefield resource. Fiber-reinforced bone constructions and organic reflex amplifiers permit efficient close combat techniques to be employed. Fitted with transmitters to send enquiries from geostationary transfer satellites, these warriors prove to be very efficient terminators, since they are able to call energy bundles from orbit by vocal command or energized protective shields. The plans exist to carry out training routines to turn these clone fighters into efficient pilots for our space attack forces. The spacecraft of the Paladin Class seem to me to be a suitable basis for this.” So what we've got here - the Creator and his kind - used genetic engineering to create the Seraphim from Dragons and Elves. Add to that a bit of the sort of thing that made Wolverine (from the X-Men - the "Fiber-reinforced bone constructions" and you can see what makes a Seraphim quite the bad arse warrior. Now then, the phrase "replenishable battlefield resource"... This sounds an awful lot like Seraphim are manufactured - grown, rapidly. Much like the clones from Star Wars episodes 1-3 and given that there are more Seraphim in Sacred 2 than there are in Sacred 1, it would seem they aren't capable of reproduction... Besides there don't seem to be any male Seraphim about. While Seraphim and Dragons are apparently related, it would be seriously doubtful they could make babies together - not with the level of technologies available in modern Ancaria. And by that, I mean the Sacred 2 era. Link to comment
Synnworld 11 Posted May 21, 2015 Author Share Posted May 21, 2015 The logo represent 2 dragon head and 2 seraphin wings. So basically the seraphim and dragons got together to have a baby named "Dragon Mage." New head connon activated. Er. That makes little sense.... If you read the book that came from Sacred 1 - The Book of the Seraphim, And I quote.. "Memorandum from Urisa'N TachYon regarding the use of cloned warriors: The first test run in the defense matrix GT-AS 565 went entirely satisfactory. The DNA morphing of Dragon Battle Lizards with female Elifa slaves produced effective fighting amazons in a very short time. These warriors can be used in combat against the three-dimensional giant Worgarians as a replenishable battlefield resource. Fiber-reinforced bone constructions and organic reflex amplifiers permit efficient close combat techniques to be employed. Fitted with transmitters to send enquiries from geostationary transfer satellites, these warriors prove to be very efficient terminators, since they are able to call energy bundles from orbit by vocal command or energized protective shields. The plans exist to carry out training routines to turn these clone fighters into efficient pilots for our space attack forces. The spacecraft of the Paladin Class seem to me to be a suitable basis for this. So what we've got here - the Creator and his kind - used genetic engineering to create the Seraphim from Dragons and Elves. Add to that a bit of the sort of thing that made Wolverine (from the X-Men - the "Fiber-reinforced bone constructions" and you can see what makes a Seraphim quite the bad arse warrior. Now then, the phrase "replenishable battlefield resource"... This sounds an awful lot like Seraphim are manufactured - grown, rapidly. Much like the clones from Star Wars episodes 1-3 and given that there are more Seraphim in Sacred 2 than there are in Sacred 1, it would seem they aren't capable of reproduction... Besides there don't seem to be any male Seraphim about. While Seraphim and Dragons are apparently related, it would be seriously doubtful they could make babies together - not with the level of technologies available in modern Ancaria. And by that, I mean the Sacred 2 era. Dont you attack my head cannon! Link to comment
mibbs 29 Posted May 21, 2015 Share Posted May 21, 2015 lso FYI in the scripts Seraphim are classified as humans as well, and the Shadow Warrior is classified as Undead, so take the technical classifications with whatever gravity you see fit. Does it mean that expulse magic's modification (non-resistable magic damage to any undead creature) hurts Shadow Warrior? Link to comment
Flix 5,116 Posted May 25, 2015 Share Posted May 25, 2015 Does it mean that expulse magic's modification (non-resistable magic damage to any undead creature) hurts Shadow Warrior? It probably does, yes. Unless there's some special hidden thing that makes him immune. Link to comment
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