Sacred 2 Build Template on DarkMatters

[Schot 407]

So I was thinking... A dangerous pass time I know. ^^

 

I've been thinking it would be nice for aspiring build authors if we had a convenient template for everyone to work with here on FDM. The basic idea would be for us to suggest what is important to mention when writing a build for others to learn from. Things like what attributes to focus on and skills to pick are generally understood information to include in a build but I'm wondering if there are other things that are a necessity to include. I'd like to also create an effective flow that will allow readers to quickly understand the concepts of the build. Intro to the build, what comes next and how to end the build writeup etc. In the meantime I'll work on one or two bbcodes that will allow us to easily link to descriptions on our wiki resource such as skills, Combat Arts, modifications, sets and any other information that might used from the wiki in order to aid in the explanation of a build. Headers for each section of a build can be placed into this template so that authors won't have to spend their time on the little stuff and focus on the general build idea instead. Possibly with a linkable index for readers to easily jump down the page and read up on something specific about the build.

 

I'll be looking at the many builds here and see what seems to flow the best. Maybe we can use one of the builds here to help us get started. Let the ideas fly!

[StiCk_eM 1]

I'd like to think mine flowed fairly nicely. A little intro followed by skills with a slight debate and conclusion on that matter. Then CAs and their mods. Followed by attributes and equipment.

 

Did it work as well as I think it did? How did it flow? I even tried to incorporate the wiki

 

StiCk_eM

[Erling 3]

I dont know if I understood what you meant... but cool

[StiCk_eM 1]

Well I was really just asking how my guide flowed because if it flowed nicely...it could be the template...hehe

 

StiCk_eM

[Schot 407]

Very nice Stick. You've updated it a great deal making it a thorough read. I'm going to try using your build as a base to work with if that's alright.

 

Essentially what I want to focus on is that many of us are very experienced with Sacred so I'm wanting to create a template that would appeal to both the veterans and the new. Us long time players can sometimes take for granted the knowledge we have and assume that everyone else already knows the basics. So it's important to cover the basics as well. A single word in a guide could potentially trip up a new player. Using the wiki to link to the basic stuff can make it easy on the author while also maintaining a level of thoroughness.

 

The whole point of this in case it's been missed is that I want to write out a coded template. Something like the Template:Quest is what I plan to do. It will be a page here on DarkMatters that will stand as a resource for those wanting to write a build guide. The template will be placed inside a code box so that authors may copy and paste the template which will contain all the basic formatting. As part of the template I may also create a CA bbcode and Skills bbcode. So for example if we were to type:

[CA]Ancestral Fireball[/CA]

The result would be the CA graphic with a brief description like we have on the wiki that would be generated.

 

Something I think that would be great to add to this template would be a section called "Ideal Battlegrounds". To explain where best the builds can defeat enemies in order to level quickly. Not all builds would need this section but some, like the High Elf, would certainly need it since a majority of her attack damage type can not be customized on the fly.

 

P.s.

Presently we have an easy way to link to the wiki with an already created bbcode. For example you could type the below in a post to link to the wiki page about Skills. Keep in mind this is bbcode to be used only for Sacred 2 related pages on the SacredWiki. To link to other pages on the wiki you can replace s2wiki with wiki in the bbcode.

[s2wiki]Skills[/s2wiki]

Skills

[inXi 0]

StiCk_eM, could you give a link to your build, please?

 

I think the best way to develop a good template is basically take a random build that's more or less concrete, and then start making the template as you go along. You'll never be able to remember everything, and going into detail such as bbcode and pictures at once may slow it down where you attempt to work it out before you test it. Go from simple to complex. Make a basic template. Apply it, and then see how you can improve it.

 

Speaking of newbies vs veterans, I can give you one bit of advice: do not overabbreviate. I read too many DII guides which are overrun with abbreviations ranging from MF to FoH to "sin" to whatnot, and they may confound a person quite a lot. Even if abbreviations are present, they should be hyperlinked.

Another thing I want to note that us (newbies) are not huge fans of choice. When we start seeing stuff like "but you could also do this if you did this while doing this" we sometimes get scared off. Which is why numbers are the best way to represent it, in addition to text. A good player usually can see possible modifications for a build on the fly, anyway.

Oh, and we hate to read. We just want our numbers.

 

A simple template would look something like:

(tags could be empty, none of these should be a "must be filled in", although I'm not too knowledgeable on templating)

 

1. <Name of the Build> (<Class>)

<Note> //This could be a description or something.

2. Skills:

<Name of Skill1>: <points>

<Reason> //E.g., explain why this skill is useful.

<Name of Skill2>: <points>

...

<Note> //This could be anything ranging from alternatives to general advice.

3. Attributes:

Strength: <points>

<Reason>

Endurance: <points>

<Reason>

...

<Note>

4. Combat Arts

<Name of Combat Art>: <Usage of Combat Art>

---- Bronze: <Usage and Pros and Cons of Bronze Modded Combat Art>

...

<Note>

5. Items

---- Final:

Head: <Item>

...

<Note> //This is getting redundant.

6. Leveling

<Leveling Range>: <Advice> //This is to aid people regarding what order should they build in for greatest survivability.

7. Gameplay

<Gameplay> //This would be explaining how this class plays.

 

You can then start putting icons for skills in there, images of the character, videos of gameplay (lol), and whatever. I believe that would be fairly simple, such as replacing the <Name of Skill1> with <Pic of Skill1>. You may want to make some of the icons smaller, mind you, especially Combat Arts, they're huge.

 

That's what I consider "essential". The material you need to get out there and start playing that build. AFTER this I'd put debates, branch-offs, suggestions, and alternative solutions (and possibly templates for them). Putting them in between could be nice but it would also clog the general simplicity of the brief summary.

Edited December 31, 2008 by inXi

[Zinsho 0]

inXi:

 

With regard to your comparison to D2 builds... Gear wise it would definitely have to be done differently from how it often shows up in D2 for the simple reason that there is no 'ideal' gear in Sacred/Sacred 2. Or at least there wasn't in S1 and from what I've seen there isn't in Sacred 2.

 

Unlike D2 Sets and Uniques are not the be-all and end-all of a build in Sacred. Certain items might be above average as choices, however a good rare, or even a good magical item can be better than the best Unique or Set you could ever find. From experience with S1 and builds I'd suggest changing it to

 

Item Modifiers:

...

//List valuable modifiers here for the build. In order of priority if some are vital and others are simply useful.

 

Attribute wise, since your stats grow as you level there is no point stating you need X points in a given statistic (particularly since Survival Bonus seems to modify statistics as well. Therefore it's really a suggestion of how to distribute your skills on level up, some sort of ratio of StatA:StatB:StatC:...

 

Although choices can be intimidating, in Sacred 2 some of the choices really are equally viable. Take Ancient Bark for the Silver Modifier: You can either reflect close combat, or evade close and ranged combat. Both are equally useful and choosing one or the other will not impact on the build to any large degree.

[inXi 0]

Well, that's good to hear. The fact that everyone in DII: LoD runs around with an Enigma isn't really a great thing. I don't know much about Sacred 2 (hey, I don't even have the game yet!), so, of course, my pondering is based on DII since it's the closest game to Sacred 2 that I know.

 

Stats grow as you level? I certainly didn't know that. It was true for Sacred but I didn't really notice it in the Sacred 2 demo.

 

I understand that choices are viable, but if they are equally viable, you can choose one of them and put the choice under the main template. Either way, the build author made the choice somewhere along the line. And, I guess, you could always do an "or".

[Zinsho 0]

Stats increase by 10% (rounded down) of their base value per level. As to survival bonus increase... I'll go check that now by doing some simple math.

 

edit:

 

By using two characters (one level 38 with 68.1% SB and one level 19 with 45.6% SB), both of which I knew the point distribution (well I am certain for the second, the first I'm 99% certain every single point is in Vitality, but slight discrepancies might have resulted from a few points into dex). Taking their current stats, accounting for the +Stats per level and for any gear equipped (from Sigma).

 

By taking (Actual Stats / Expected Stats) I found how much it improved by. Since it varied slightly per stat I took the average of all 6. The resulting multiplier is equal to roughly SB/2.

 

0.36 vs 0.34 for the higher level character (SB/2 = 0.34)

0.23 vs 0.21 for the lower level character (SB/2 = 0.21)

Edited January 1, 2009 by Zinsho

[StiCk_eM 1]

You can find my guide here. Seems like you guys are getting the idea of it though, but take a look and see what you think.

 

StiCk_eM

[Zinsho 0]

Based on inXi's request regarding a very simple facts & numbers only version of the build I might suggest something akin to the Quest Template in the sense that there is a Detailed version and a Summarized Version. For the Wiki I would probably suggest the summary version first, particularly since you can easily sublink to the various sections of the build using the menu on the side.

 

However I also might suggest that were these posted in forums that the summarized version come second in those cases so that those wanting the full details don't have to look for them. It's easy enough to scroll down to the second post if you're in a hurry to get to the short and simple version.

[Schot 407]

I like these ideas guys. In particular the suggestion to encourage authors not to use abbreviations and the placement of the summarized writeup under the detailed is probably a wise idea. Though I may be able to apply a type of linking menu like it is on the wiki using anchor links. Maybe it could also be encouraged for authors to place their build's other possible choices in a section called "alternatives" between the detailed and summarized write ups.

 

I like the formatting suggested. It's exactly what I'm going for. The less people have to type the more enjoyable it will be. In fact there may be a mod out there that would automatically convert words relating to wiki titles into links. Which I'm looking for right now.