Dual Wield Question

[belgarathmth 21]

Hello, I am thinking of taking dual wield on my shadow warrior, but also hafted weapons, to unlock the affixes, especially chance to stun.

 

Is that a smart thing to do? I know that the attack bonuses from the skills will not work at the same time, but I am thinking of switching around from wielding two lightsabers, or a lightsaber and a one-handed hammer or mace, two one-handed hammers/maces, or a two-handed %life leech hammer against bosses.

 

My idea is to leave hafted weapons skill at one point, just for the affix unlocking, and to put a few points into dual wield for some attack bonuses and speed while using two one-handers. Most of my skill points are currently going into Malevolent Champion Focus, Death Warrior Focus, Tactics Lore, and Armor Lore. I want to start building Toughness after that.

 

So, I wouldn't actually build either weapon skill for a long, long time in the toon's career. But they might serve as "one-point wonders", by unlocking both the ability to hold a weapon in each hand and benefit from the affixes on both, and unlocking the skill-based affixes on hafted weapons. I don't really need Sword Lore for affixes, because I am only using lightsabers, not regular swords.

 

Will the game switch bonuses from dual wield to hafted when a two-handed hammer is equipped, and the toon has both skills?

 

Has anyone ever tried this before?

 

Thanks.

Edited May 24, 2013 by belgarathmth

[wolfie2kX 528]

OK.. So let's see if I have this right. You're taking Hafted weapons and Dual Wield and you want to put few, if any points into either skill until much, much later - and you want to know if the DW skill points will still stack with the hafted skill points if you're not dual wielding... First off - we gotta ask - does it really matter? If you're only putting 1 point into the system just to unlock the skill, you're not going to get much, if any bonus to attack value or speed. BUT... We can sully forth and figure this out.

 

Hmmm. Just so happens I have a Seraphim loaded in the game right now who has DW. She doesn't have any other weapons skills - swords, or hafted. But I think this will still work out OK since we want to know if the DW skill boosts translate when not dual wielding.

 

The answer would be NO.

 

Equipping my Seraphim with nothing but an empty weapons slot - the speed is 110.6%... So we can call that the baseline...

 

When I equip my Seraphim with two swords, her attack speed is 133.1%. When I switch to another single weapon, it drops back down to 110.6% - which is a difference of 22.5%... Checking my DW skill stats - it's supposed to be boosting speed 22.3%. Close enough for Government Work...

 

So there you have it...

[claudius 104]

The hafted skill applies while wielding a two handed axe. The dual wield applies when dual wielding single handed weapons such as axe, sword, or lightsaber.

 

The 1 spec in dualwield means you will be slow, but more importantly with a decent survival bonus weapons will drop which since only 1 pt that means you can't use them without an additional attack speed penalty. With a melee toon I would always put points in dual wield. Maybe less than 75 but you want to be able to use the weapons that drop without having to wait a whole long time. For focus some people say 21 pts is a sweet spot for rewarding investment. Maybe that is true of any skill?

[Aegis 256]

Well, in my opinion, there is nothing wrong with having both duel wield and hafted weapons for the sake of doing what you suggest (opening modifiers and switching up weapons for different scenarios such as going from mobs to bosses). I'm of the stance that one weapon skill, be it duel wield or hafted weapons, is all I need. It keeps things simple, and my shadow warrior is already an efficient killing machine. If you do still go that route, I read somewhere that swords give better options than hafted weapons in terms of modifiers and the like. Either way, my answer would be I rather you don't take both, but doing it won't hurt either.

 

As for whether bonuses get changed from duel wielding to using a two handed axe, assuming by bonuses you mean the attack values and speed from selecting weapon skills, I figure if it didn't switch from one skill to the other, I wouldn't see people suggesting to go the route of mob killing for duel wield and champions and bosses for two handers in the first place.

[wolfie2kX 528]

Btw... Just had a peek at lightsabers..

 

Got some bad news for ya. - they happen to fall under the category of SWORD weapons, not Hafted.

 

 

 

[Thorin Oakshield 260]

Asking a question like this is more or less stirring up a hornet's nest. Main reason is that there are two party's defending both options. One group saying it's worth it, one group saying you're wasting one - or two - skills.

 

Fact is; the skills won't stack. Investing points in Hafted Weapon Lore, won't increase your attack speed on top of the attack speed of Dual Wield. Or in math: your + 25% AS from HWL won't be added to the +27.3% from your DW skills.

Fact is: investing a single point in HWL is useless, since the moment you start finding level 75 weapons, they ask about Hafted Weapons Mastery. Meaning you need to add 75 points in that skill to make sure you unlock the future bonuses too.

Fact is: not all weapons get their modifiers unlocked with HWL, meaning you have to take Sword Weapon Lore as well to unlock the bonuses of those weapons.

Fact is: There aren't any modifiers unlocked with the DW skill; unless you're playing the I&B add-on and the Community Patch, since the latter has some weapons with DW modifiers added.

 

So, your options:

 

1) Play with all three skills - DW, HWL, SWL - and invest points in DW only, and one point in HWL and SWL to unlock the bonuses for the latter;

2) Play with all three skills - DW, HWL, SWL - and invest 75 points in all three of them to unlock the Master Bonuses

3) Play with all three skills - DW, HWL, SWL - and invest 75 points in HWL and SWL and one point in DW to unlock that skill.
(Personally, I would suggest that, although I don't like the idea of picking HWL and SWL for the bonuses, as I see it as a waste of skills and skill points.)

4) Play with DW only and master that kill up to 75 points.

This gives you the ability to pick one of two "fun" skills, like EP or Bargaining, Black Smith, etc; depending at your character.
This is how I personally like to play, as having one of two "fun" skills sometimes pays off a lot better when having multiple chars. Even in SP.

 

 

Regards,

 

Thorin

[wolfie2kX 528]

Thorin -

 

You bring up some excellent points. Some additions...

 

1.) The point that around level 75 or so, you WILL be finding stuff asking for the related mastery... That means, of course, you'll be spending the next 15 or so levels pumping points into the related skill to bring it from 1 point to 75. That CAN get ugly.

 

2.) I know of only 1 weapon thus far in the latest CM Patch that has the DW association. It's part of the 'Remnants of Drizzt' set called Icingdeath. The set was designed to be dual-wielded and in order to get the full set bonus, you have to have both swords (and the associated ring and ammy). Ironically, the other sword in the set - 'Twinkle' has the Sword skill modifier.

 

There may be others, but as of yet, I haven't come across any.

 

3.) Having DW and one other weapons skill is what makes most sense - unless you're the type who can't seem to settle on one strategy and stay the course.

 

Truth be told, there are plenty of cool weapons of EVERY category to get you through the game. Just have to use a bit of self discipline and not go gonzo on the various skills. Someone could go nuts and get Sword, Hafted, Pole, Ranged Weapons and Magic Staffs and NOT have any skills left to do much of anything else. That's 5 skills there, add in Tactics Lore and you're left with 4 skills.

[belgarathmth 21]

Thanks for the replies, but most people completely misunderstood my question(s). I know the two skills don't stack. My question was whether they will switch back and forth.

 

I know that lightsabers count as sword weapons, but they also don't have affixes to unlock, or at least none in my collection do.

 

I also had no idea I was asking anything controversial. What I asked was whether anyone had tried it before.

 

Anyway, I took the dual wield, and it seems pretty powerful on its own with two lightsabers. Somebody around here playfully called it "Sacred 2's version of the Veg-a-matic. Slice 'em, dice 'em, make julienne fries." I'm going to go look up what "julienne fries" are now.

Edited May 26, 2013 by belgarathmth

[lujate 578]

Yes, they switch back and forth. I often took DW & SW on my seraphim. I would DW normally and use a 2H for LL% against bosses.

[belgarathmth 21]

Thanks, @lujate, it sounds like you've done exactly what I was asking about, except with Sword Weapons in your case. Did you find it to be a fun, efficient toon, or did you regret spending a spot on the Sword Weapons?

[lujate 578]

Thanks, @lujate, it sounds like you've done exactly what I was asking about, except with Sword Weapons in your case. Did you find it to be a fun, efficient toon, or did you regret spending a spot on the Sword Weapons?

It worked great and I would do it again.

[Delta! 988]

I also have a Seraphim and a Shadow warrior with both Sword weapons and dual wield, and I try to level them up evenly (maybe favour the DW a bit more) and have a powerful 2handed sword handy incase I need it, and it always works great for me...

 

Delta!

[wolfie2kX 528]

Thanks for the replies, but most people completely misunderstood my question(s). I know the two skills don't stack. My question was whether they will switch back and forth.

 

I know that lightsabers count as sword weapons, but they also don't have affixes to unlock, or at least none in my collection do.

 

I also had no idea I was asking anything controversial. What I asked was whether anyone had tried it before.

 

Anyway, I took the dual wield, and it seems pretty powerful on its own with two lightsabers. Somebody around here playfully called it "Sacred 2's version of the Veg-a-matic. Slice 'em, dice 'em, make julienne fries." I'm going to go look up what "julienne fries" are now.

 

Julienne is a culinary term for cutting vegetables into what looks like matchsticks - of the wooden variety.