Who here is going to give Borderlands as much love as Sacred 2

[gogoblender 3,070]

I've seen posts about this in the SIF. I know the graphics are awesome, that the world is huge, that there is some depth to builds.

 

However.

 

I also have been told that the builds get boring after the first month, that the depth of builds isn't on Sacred 2's level, but that borderlands was a good effort.

 

Yay or Nay?

 

I remember r00ster saying he thought this game was going to blow Sacred 2 out of the water...but I also remember him leaving it and now playing Sacred 2 with the expansion. ^^

 

Does Borderlands have the staying power of Sacred 2...or is it's attempt, while respectable, not enough to create a community as strong as Ascaron's legacy here on this forum and with SacredWiki?

 

 

gogo

[dizzy_casper 0]

I've seen posts about this in the SIF. I know the graphics are awesome, that the world is huge, that there is some depth to builds.

 

However.

 

I also have been told that the builds get boring after the first month, that the depth of builds isn't on Sacred 2's level, but that borderlands was a good effort.

 

Yay or Nay?

 

I remember r00ster saying he thought this game was going to blow Sacred 2 out of the water...but I also remember him leaving it and now playing Sacred 2 with the expansion. ^^

 

Does Borderlands have the staying power of Sacred 2...or is it's attempt, while respectable, not enough to create a community as strong as Ascaron's legacy here on this forum and with SacredWiki?

 

 

gogo

I think its a wonderful game but not as in depth as Sacred 2. But definitely worth some luv. I just finished the main game, and can't wait to get the add-ons.

 

 

I've seen posts about this in the SIF. I know the graphics are awesome, that the world is huge, that there is some depth to builds.

 

However.

 

I also have been told that the builds get boring after the first month, that the depth of builds isn't on Sacred 2's level, but that borderlands was a good effort.

 

Yay or Nay?

 

I remember r00ster saying he thought this game was going to blow Sacred 2 out of the water...but I also remember him leaving it and now playing Sacred 2 with the expansion. ^^

 

Does Borderlands have the staying power of Sacred 2...or is it's attempt, while respectable, not enough to create a community as strong as Ascaron's legacy here on this forum and with SacredWiki?

 

 

gogo

I think its a wonderful game but not as in depth as Sacred 2. But definitely worth some luv. I just finished the main game, and can't wait to get the add-ons.

Hey gogo sorry for getting off this topic, but I wish they would release add-ons of Sacred 2 for the PS3. Then I think Sacred 2 would get all my love!

[Rusto 0]

The builds dont have as much depth, but the gameplay is sublime. It is a LOT of fun

[gogoblender 3,070]

What about it's community, it's staying power. I love seeing how community's support games. Is borderland's wiki as big as SacredWiki's? What about staying power, ...will peeps keep playing Borderlands for more than a year like here with Sacred 2...even with the console players?

 

 

gogo

[Spunky 16]

Even though I have never tried Borderlands nor do I have plans to try out it as what I've heard and seen about it doesn't peek my interest at all, I would say Borderlands doesn't stand a chance against the legacy you guys here at DM have built up from scratch both here and the Wiki.

 

Perhaps it has good graphics, but for me graphics means nada.

 

No games I have ever played have had the depths of character builds that the Sacred games have, nor do I think we'll ever see a game that will have it as it doesn't suit the "average" player.

 

Just my thoughts on the subject, feel free to delete the post if it wasn't the answer you looked for.

[gogoblender 3,070]

Even though I have never tried Borderlands nor do I have plans to try out it as what I've heard and seen about it doesn't peek my interest at all, I would say Borderlands doesn't stand a chance against the legacy you guys here at DM have built up from scratch both here and the Wiki.

 

Perhaps it has good graphics, but for me graphics means nada.

 

No games I have ever played have had the depths of character builds that the Sacred games have, nor do I think we'll ever see a game that will have it as it doesn't suit the "average" player.

 

Just my thoughts on the subject, feel free to delete the post if it wasn't the answer you looked for.

 

 

Spunky I like the response. We're going somewhere I wanted to discuss for a long time about the philosophy of games released on console. Here's the thing... we have a lot of console players now all a part of the legacy of Sacred 2, here on this forum and the wiki (btw thanks for the kinds words! )

 

Mostly all my friends at work who all have consoles don't even want to think of playing a game for more than one month. In a strange way, I kind of feel that console games are designed heinously with this in mind. That the games as well as their community have been created to consume games quickly so as to make sales jump.

 

Games that are too good, have too much depth consume an purchaser's time for less money than buying new ones every few weeks.

 

Plot?

 

 

gogo

[Rusto 0]

You may be right Gogo, but I think time constraints and budget also play a part in just how much can be done with a game. More powerful gaming systems also mean more attention to detail. To stop the game world from looking like one giant repeating formula, more time needs to be spent on the ever increasing intricacies(that is a wierd word, had to google to make sure I spelled it right!)

[Spunky 16]

I'm not much into console games so I can't answer what purpose they have in mind when they where made, but as I've seen tons of times is that it seems that getting the achievements unlocked is the main point rather than have fun with the game.

 

But on the other hand that means that they need to play the game more than just one quick run through it to finish, I know this from a RL friend as even though he despise the game; he plays only to unlock the achievements.

 

So for me it seems that unlocking achievements was introduced to keep the player playing the game more than just rush through it to get their hands on the next "hot" game title.

[Rusto 0]

Which is bizarre imo, the gamerscore is usefull for nothing lol. Just a number.

[gogoblender 3,070]

I remember on the SIF how strong people were saying borderlands was going to be. It's funny because I spent a lot of time looking at the videos. It seems like the level of detail and graphics is something that could keep me enthralled for a while.

 

Ultimately though it's depth of builds that keeps me hooked. And with Sacred 2, the sheer number of bugs creates an infinite number of mysteries regarding game mechanics.

 

Are we ever REALLY gonna be certain that something we've documented is real... or a bug?

 

However...this sort of depth via the unknown also pulls in huge numbers of people. And...when you find a number of interested people from that group who want to help with the database...everything changes.

 

People get hooked, want to keep on trying new ideas out...and becuase the original depth is there... we can keep plumbing. And of course plumbing with others is just about the most coolest thing ever specially when they're friends, and the results, which is answer to basic game mechanics finally Kaching for us.

 

I was thinking that perhaps Borderlands would be the console's game that could do this ^^

 

gogo

[Rusto 0]

but the gameplay is sublime. It is a LOT of fun

 

This

[colif 36]

I managed to get 3 hunters up to almost the end of that game, I struggled with the rest of the classes to beat the 1st boss (though brick did it easy, he got stuck on an elite just getting to the 2nd boss), there are only 4 classes and not much in the way of build variety. It has an immense random selection of weapons, but I guess so does Sacred 2. I bought the zombie killing dlc, it made me play a few more weeks.

 

I only played the single player mode, perhaps that was why.

[kriv 14]

I like the game but was frustrated with poor implementation of it on pc (menus are crap, having to rechange the POV in the ini files, and the poor matchmaking).

[Etherian 76]

Even though I have never tried Borderlands nor do I have plans to try out it as what I've heard and seen about it doesn't peek my interest at all, I would say Borderlands doesn't stand a chance against the legacy you guys here at DM have built up from scratch both here and the Wiki.

 

Perhaps it has good graphics, but for me graphics means nada.

 

No games I have ever played have had the depths of character builds that the Sacred games have, nor do I think we'll ever see a game that will have it as it doesn't suit the "average" player.

 

Just my thoughts on the subject, feel free to delete the post if it wasn't the answer you looked for.

 

 

Spunky I like the response. We're going somewhere I wanted to discuss for a long time about the philosophy of games released on console. Here's the thing... we have a lot of console players now all a part of the legacy of Sacred 2, here on this forum and the wiki (btw thanks for the kinds words! )

 

Mostly all my friends at work who all have consoles don't even want to think of playing a game for more than one month. In a strange way, I kind of feel that console games are designed heinously with this in mind. That the games as well as their community have been created to consume games quickly so as to make sales jump.

 

Games that are too good, have too much depth consume an purchaser's time for less money than buying new ones every few weeks.

 

Plot?

 

 

gogo

 

Very well said gogo! I have given much thought on this very topic!

 

My own personal conclusion is...[in simple terms] within these corporate gaming companies lies an insatiable amount of greed. The overall sales is the only inate property which stands a chance to fulfull this massive blackhole.

 

I treasure games such as Sacred 2. An ongoing nightmare I have from time to time is...once these treasures are no longer supported via corporate, where do we turn to fulfill our own greed?

 

Lets continue thinking...

 

I remain, Etherian

[colif 36]

Its to feed the A.D.D. generation, with attention spans shorter then my little finger. I met that attitude on the Just Cause 2 forums, no one there believed that the devs would patch any faults and half were already planning to play RDR anyway. Game had been out 2 weeks and they were complaining they had no dlc, then complained (once they got dlc) that it wasn't enough, and that they shouldn't be making DLC until they patch game. Still 6 weeks later there is no patch, I have hit bugs that stop me enjoying game as much as I would like to, but I have patience and just wait for them to fix bugs. Forums used to be the place to go and solve problems, not act like a baby and go me, me, me! No wonder the devs ignore them.

 

I hope they are wrong, that game could be so much better with a few expansions adding more different things to do. It would be such a waste.

 

I look long term, I like games that take forever to finish as that feels like value for money. I can't afford to buy new games all the time, I actually liked WOW because while I played it for 2 & 1/2 years, I saved money I would have wasted looking for a game to fill up my time. That is why I liked Diablo2 so much, it kept me occupied for a long time. I only stop playing long term games when it gets to stage I can't stand looking at them ever again.

[AussieBoB 0]

I've clocked this game about 5 times, and also done the 3 addons, moxie, armory, and ned's island. it's awesome! Though that game takes far less time I reckon to clock than sacred, I've spent 10 hours on one character(my very first) and only got to level 20. In borderlands, I clocked it in one whole day ^_^ (straight playing ). I played it on pc, and found it rather easy to play multiplayer, and most things were self explanatory, with the story sorta keeping my attention, until I started ignoring quest text, and just killing. I'd say it was only fun, due to the multiplayer aspect, else it'd be very draining, to solo clock the game, and the last boss is rather impossible to kill, the krawmerax T_T

so back to the question.. I think it's about your personal preference, the character development aren't as good as sacred, although no +15etc items to all skills, making every point worth somthing, nd for me it was rather captivating.

[Rusto 0]

I think people should be more greatfull to be honest!

 

Some spend £50 or more just for one night of fun, that puts it in perspective Or maybe just highlights how much we all get ripped off when going out for some drinks...

 

One thing I take into consideration, is that whilst I still value games that last a lonnng time... I also value games that have a unique and special experience. Even if they are short. Movies for instance are normally less than a couple hours long, most I'll watch once and thats it, but some of the films I've really enjoyed I've watched literally dozens of times. Same goes for games, there is a few in my collection that are just an awesome experience, and every now and again, I'll feel like dipping into that world again.

[Rndm 1]

I love Borderlands, but the world size/character building depth don't come close to Sacred 2.

[Sarcolemming 8]

Having played all of borderlands including the main campaign on both difficulty levels(including 2.5 the "uber" difficulty), as well as all of the add ons. I have to say it's a wonderful game, but needs more content in general. Granted there are zillions of guns, some 16 million+, but the actual areas are rather limited. Unlike Sacred 2 it often has the problem of looking generally the same regardless of where you are in the world or what time of day it is, while it's fun to play most of the builds often gravitate towards certain things you either love or hate. For example the siren class can be a sniper or a machine gunner. No matter what way you go, inevitably you end up as one or the other.

 

To be fair it's a nice game, but has no where near the lasting power of sacred 2, that doesn't mean though that I won't go back to it at some point in the future. Right now however, I'm more absorbed with Transformers: War for Cybertron, the role playing part is a little downplayed(mostly restricted to a few small but important choices such as guns, and skills-read same as borderlands but simpler-) but it's an incredible shooter none the less.

 

#2 in the world on conquest mode woot! woot! ~shameless plug ^^;

[Llama8 8]

It doesn't have "zillions" of guns though, it has ~8 basic weapon types (alien weapons, combat rifles, pistols, revolvers, rocket launchers, shotguns, sniper rifles & SMGs & a few pieces of non-weapon equipment) & then a load of different item mods which give a large number of possible permutations (ie, possible items). Sacred 2 has ~6-8 basic weapon types (depending on whether you could on/two handed swords/hafted are different) & then ~10 other non-weapon equipment types (shields, rings, amulets & all the other armour) and then a shedload of item mods, so I don't think "a bazillion guns" is really a unique selling point for an aRPG.

 

As others have said, the gameplay is fairly simple, but that's not always a bad thing. It's fun, but it's not got the longevity that Sacred 2 does.

[gogoblender 3,070]

Sacred 2 has ~6-8 basic weapon types (depending on whether you could on/two handed swords/hafted are different) & then ~10 other non-weapon equipment types (shields, rings, amulets & all the other armour) and then a shedload of item mods, so I don't think "a bazillion guns" is really a unique selling point for an aRPG.

 

 

That is interesting. And you've distinguished well tween real depth and pseudo depth. Besides all the weps in the game, the way everything twines up with item mods takes this game off the deep end for me.

 

There are definitely games out there with more polish. But still, no other single stand up game I've seen can keep a community going for this long.

 

 

gogo

[Rotluchs 82]

I tried out Borderlands for the very first time just a few days ago, although I had it 'sitting in the shelf' for quite some time now..

 

that 'fallout'/endgame/apocalypse' setting (or whatever) sounded interesting,

 

unfortunately I did get hooked up yet..

 

one of my very first impressions were:

 

..ha, that R2-D2 looks funny, talks funny..

..uuh, that 'cell shading'-alike graphics look interesting, yet also a little strange..

..ah, there's a lot of crates you can break, searching for loot?

..well but character development and item diversity isnt what I'd expect for any RPG with some 'depth'

 

..diving into a toilet for some cash was 'fun' the first time, but seriously, in that starting area.. everyone seems to run some 'dirty' business ?

 

after like 30 toilet bowls or so I gave up, only either a few stinking bucks or the same standard ammo-clips to find, anyway..

 

so? is the some interesting main-plot / story to follow afterall, for which I should give borderlands another try?

(as equipment/char-development& skills already aren't what I'd expect..)

 

if there isnt, like in KoToR:1 for example, I'm gonna pass on this one for now.. maybe later.

Edited July 2, 2010 by Rotluchs

[Llama8 8]

I think it also depends where you're coming from Gogo. If you're coming at it from an FPS point of view, then yes, there are a bazillion guns & it is a USP. If you're coming at it from an aRPG point of view, the amount of weapons is nothing special & it's disappointing that there's very little other gear (no armour, etc). And benefit of simplified gameplay is that it's easier to debug, is more focussed & it's probably easier to keep the pace up.

[Manzikeen 0]

I've played Borderlands, played all the DLC, and still jump on with friends now and again. Its certainly not Sacred2 but it has its own quirks that make it fun. You can't really approach it expecting this indepth RPG, its a fun little comic book-ish type shooter with added RPG elements. If you read the official forums there is a bit of depth to character builds that people have put some work into but it still comes no where near what you can do in Sacred 2. The community there is as friendly as they come too, find a few good friends to play with and you can have fun gunning down various enemies and watch midgets burn, explode, melt, or get shocked to death. I would expect to see a follow up in a couple years or so and wouldn't be surprised to see more depth and polish. All in all though, its a good game and can be a good time with a few friends to play it with.

[r00ster 1]

The game was incredible, but there is really only one way to play Borderlands: 4 player online.

 

Single player and such was like any other FPS with simple RPG bits thrown in. It is definitely a FPS before an RPG.

However, I've liked many FPS' in my time aside RPGs, and with 3 other players this was some of the absolute most fun I've ever had online gaming bar none.

 

Now though, the game got way to 'hacked' with modded gear etc and pubs, randoms etc were all ruined.

We kept on for a while in private games, and sometimes still do, however the damage was done.

 

The DLC's were awesome as well. I still really love the game, but it's so hacked on both PC and XBOX we eventually just gave up.

 

I would say skip this game now, as the awesomeness it was has been lost, but even though a short time it was really incredible online gaming. Polar opposite of Sacred though, sacreds MP boils down to chat. Borderlands was total teamplay on everything, with 4 unique characters. If it hadn't of been hacked to death, I'd probably still play it, but that goes for so many games.. so many....

 

Cheers,