S2 compared to WoW

[sydetys 0]

Do anyone know: if I like Sacred 2, would I like WoW?

 

I thought to buy it, Sacred 2 only supports (from manual) 16 players online and I am interested when world map is huge and many many people online. + WoW is pure multiplayer, focus on one thing and the better outcome, usually.

 

what say you?

[sirpennywise 0]

they are 2 totally different games,

Sacred 2 is a RPG/Hack and slash with multiplayer, its kind of like a Massive Multiplayer .. but not really. its alot faster paced,

 

Wow is a true MMOrpg, its alot slower paced, not as much char customization, wow requires a monthly fee and you have to purchase expansions to keep up with everyone else, also in my own experience, it was harder when playing wow to find people to help me do things, or help me aquire items,

 

sorry this is kind of a rough comparison of the two .. just throwing out a few facts, ive played both .. and they are not all that similar..

[Llama8 8]

They are (as I understand it, not really having played WoW) very different, WoW is an MMO with slower pacing & has large raids (dungeons/quests that require a large team, like 25 people), said large raids can take a long time to complete (similar to the larger dungeons in GW?).

 

it was harder when playing wow to find people to help me do things, or help me aquire items

 

That's what gluids/clans are for. Some of my friends frmo S1/GW play WoW & they help each other do stuff/etc.

[Cthulhu 0]

I played WOW on and off for about 2-3 years. I purchased it on launch day and grew to hate it with every passing moment. I gave up on it after about 3-4 months of enduring the game's first expansion pack. There hasn't been a moment where I have missed it. Suffice to say, my analysis below will be biased (toward Sacred 2):

 

The Similarities:

 

- Both use large worlds with the occasional add-on/update.

- Both use the tired and worn out Everquest formula of having you do hundreds of quests and/or kill lots of monsters to level up.

- Both emphasize character builds and proper move/spell/attack selection as well as modifications for said moves/spells/attacks.

- Both feature the addictive concept of getting lots of equipment, modifying it, etc.

 

The Differences:

 

+ Combat

- Combat in Sacred 2 is extremely fast paced and (at times) very violent. You can take on tons of enemies at once.

- WOW's combat is extremely slow since it uses a psuedo-turn based RPG combat system (with the transparent feel of real time due to the fact that you can move around in combat, jump, etc.)

To explain further: As with most turn based RPGs, you meet an opponent and chose a move as soon as it is ready, use it, and then wait for it to be ready again. The moves cost MP/Rage/Whatever fuels them.

Unlike with most RPG games though, you do not control your weapon swings/default attacks. You have an automatic attack, but you only have to worry about turning it on or off.

And last but not least: You cannot hope to take on tons of enemies at once; there is no mowing down monsters in WOW.

 

+ Game Mechanics

- Sacred 2 has its share of rich game mechanics, but if you read up on the wiki and spend some time in single player, you should be able to get the jist of it in a couple of days.

- WOW can take a very long time to get used to, especially if you end up trying out different characters before you decide on the one you like the most.

 

+ Story/Humor

 

- Sacred 2 is heavy on silly stuff and being funny. It also features numerous implementations of things from other places in real life that which we wished we could play in an ARPG setting, but never had the chance up until now. Ascaron is apparently not afraid to exercise the "imitation is the sincerest form of flattery" excuse.

- WOW has a storyline, but it is almost ignorable due to the way the game "dumps" you in the middle of nowhere and tells you: "OK, YOU'RE IN AZEROTH, HAVE FUN!"

However, WOW does have quite a few moments of jokes and such, but nothing as wacky as Sacred 2.

 

+ Character's Individual Power

- Sacred 2 makes a great emphasis on your ability to become extremely powerful and a "legend" (as the trailers state).

- World of Warcraft puts limits on your power growth early on and thus, does the exact opposite from Sacred 2 - groups are the only way to get almost anything done.

Furthermore, the game emphasizes the over-used "holy trinity" cliche - a melee damage dealer cannot heal or do big explosive attacks, a magic caster cannot wear decent armor, and a healer is pretty much stuck as a support/healing character. There are a couple of "all purpose" characters who can do more than one thing, but they always end up getting shoved into a particular role due to people having biases about who does what for the party.

 

+ Time Sinkage

- Sacred 2 currently has a time sink involved with leveling up, exploration, travel and finding your desired equipment.

- World of Warcraft has an exponentially larger time sink (due to the fact that Blizzard is making money off of monthly subscriptions, and want you to take as long as possible to do everything you want to do). In fact, time sinks are prevalent throughout the majority of the game.

 

For example, there are a lot of Guilds in WOW that will not keep members that cannot commit to the guild's weekly raid/dungeon schedule.

 

+ Social Support

- Sacred 2 ATM has limited social support: primarily the forums, the pre-existing Sacred community/fan sites and the Sacred2.net website.

- WOW has considerable (although arguably still limited in comparison to other MMO games) internal and external social support. Guild system being the most notable.

 

+ Cost

- Sacred 2 is well, uh, free to play online.

- WOW costs a monthly fee

 

+ Company Size

- Ascaron is a veteran in the game world, but they are nowhere as nearly as big as Blizzard. I'm not going to get into the other ups and downs associated with this, but I felt it should be pointed out to reinforce/discourage any lingering ideas that you may have regarding what Ascaron & Blizzard are capable of doing/not doing.

Edited February 10, 2009 by Cthulhu

[Katran 0]

Nice comparison there Cthulhu.

I will like to add to this the following and it will start with a RL story.

 

A friend of mine and I meet a weeks TCG tournament it is Saturday morning and we both are sleepy as hell. He asks me "what did you do last night?" I said "I played Sacred[the original game] with some friends we had a blast we went to BC[bear cave] and OS[over spawned] the place. The battles where hard and it took a team play to pull it off in the end we got some levels added to our toons a lot of laughs and managed to stay alive". My friend then says "I hear you I played all night WOW till early in the morning got only one level and even died". I said "so what? Big deal you died in WOW". He says "Man I had to take a walk of shame from the grave yard to where my Character died to get my gear[or something dont remember it was some time ago]". I said "And?" "well it was a hard thing to do everyone from my clan saw that". I said "your Character didnt really die in sacred HC when a toon dies he is not coming back he is dead for good." my firends face was this

 

So to sum it up Saced2 has Hard Core mode. If you ask me that is the only way to play a game. 10 hours of not just WOW any other game for that matter with out HC cant measure to 1 hour of Sacred2 HC[or any other game with HC]

Get a toon up some 100levels and play it in HC every minute of play will be a 100 times more rewording the adrenalin rush is high and when you log out and turn the PC off well you know you put your hard work on that toon on the line and after many battles came out on top.

[Pyrobelle 0]

by the looks of things the comparisons have already been made.

 

ill just add that I refused to play WoW cause of the fact that imo WoW killed D2. I went from D2 to Hellgate, but Hellgate kinda died.

 

im very glad to have found Sacred 2, the action RPG will always hold a place in my heart. and the thing about Sacred 2 is, it feels like an MMO sometimes, I mean, the game world is so vast you can actually get lost (the amount of times ive had to stop, kill a mob then hit Z and tab then M to find out where the hell im going.)

 

if Asaron squash afew more bugs in the next patch and maybe add some more content ill be very happy continuing playing Sacred 2.

 

Pyro.

 

[Erling 3]

2 diffrenet generes.. is hard to compare in any other way than Chutlhu did but the sacred communety would be the best I ever been in

 

my advice is to try the 10days free trial of wow

https://signup.worldofwarcraft.com/trial/freetrial.html

[Cthulhu 0]

One thing that I did like about WOW (more than Sacred 2) is that WOW has a significantly better grasp on the concept of "quest rewards". That being said, I am sure Ascaron is working to get the quests up to the expectations of people who have played other "quest intensive games". Otherwise, I can't see the game flying too well on the PS3/Xbox 360... especially when you have people who are used to games like Oblivion.

 

 

Edit: One comparison I forgot to mention -

 

The graphics in WOW, compared to Sacred 2... suck.

Edited February 11, 2009 by Cthulhu

[Dobri 55]

I'd have to say, that there is one thing that Lineage 2 or WoW games help the players in Sacred 2 - and that is to get used to the grinding For example, thanks to Lineage 2 (I played L2 retail on Hindemith, but I have never played wow retail, but I did try it out on my own server) I have no problems grinding like crazy and rounding off kobolds all day long

[Cthulhu 0]

Pfft, I grew up on "grinding". I'd make it a habit out of leveling all of my party members up to 99 whenever I got my hands on the latest Final Fantasy* game. But yeah, for those who are not accustomed to playing Sacred 2... WOW & such does offer a pretty good... "tutorial" on senseless slaughtering.

 

 

 

 

*FF4 is my favorite game of all time, BTW

[Llama8 8]

- Both use the tired and worn out Everquest formula of having you do hundreds of quests and/or kill lots of monsters to level up.

 

An excellent comparison Cthulhu, though I'm interested to know how you could/would change the above.

 

Quest rewards - I think this is an issue, but given the large number of quests & that people are already complaining that their characters are out-levelling the areas (if they do many quests), if they increased the rewards too much people would level up faster & get above the area's level cap even faster than they are now.

 

I also think that it would be as much of a mistake to compare Sacred 2 to Oblivion as it would be to compare it to WoW. Oblivion is a "proper" RPG (well, more so than Sacred 2) where the story-telling is the important thing, in Sacred 2 killing hordes of monsters & picking up nice shiny new gear is the important thing... They also might not appreciate the fact that Sacred 2 laughs at itself (people already complain that some of the combat voice-overs "ruin" the immersion, I don't think they like that some them refer to Sacred 2 as a game & the character talks to the player).

[Genenut 8]

Personally if you are thinking of a mmorpg I would try Guild Wars. no monthly fee and the graphics are nice. I've been playing for over a year now and I still havent been even close to everywhere.

 

And for those who like HC , try to get the survivor title.... The closest I've ever gotten was a level 18 ranger... (have to get to level 20 without dying to get the 1st level of the title, there are 3 levels for the title track)... I am still trying to get that title.

 

They have events for most of the holidays and a few others that are specific to the game. I really enjoy the game.

[Cthulhu 0]

- Both use the tired and worn out Everquest formula of having you do hundreds of quests and/or kill lots of monsters to level up.

 

An excellent comparison Cthulhu, though I'm interested to know how you could/would change the above.

 

Quest rewards - I think this is an issue, but given the large number of quests & that people are already complaining that their characters are out-levelling the areas (if they do many quests), if they increased the rewards too much people would level up faster & get above the area's level cap even faster than they are now.

 

I also think that it would be as much of a mistake to compare Sacred 2 to Oblivion as it would be to compare it to WoW. Oblivion is a "proper" RPG (well, more so than Sacred 2) where the story-telling is the important thing, in Sacred 2 killing hordes of monsters & picking up nice shiny new gear is the important thing... They also might not appreciate the fact that Sacred 2 laughs at itself (people already complain that some of the combat voice-overs "ruin" the immersion, I don't think they like that some them refer to Sacred 2 as a game & the character talks to the player).

 

 

Edit: To specifically 'change' that formula and how it is applied to Sacred 2, or in general? If you mean for Sacred 2, I would like to think on answering that question. I think if I were to answer it right now, it would sound like something that would be unrealistic and too game wrecking.

 

As for the changing the formula in general, that's something else that I think will slowly "evolve", but never actually "go away".

 

------------------------------------------

 

Onto your other comments -

 

If it is not an issue, it could just be a conflict of ideas between the players and Ascaron .

 

I think a lot of the quests should offer something else beyond the obligatory random drop, gold and experience points. However, for some reason or another, I am under the impression that the quests are not entirely finished. I'd like to wait and see until the game gets patched to the version that is going to be pressed on the PS3/Xbox 360 ports before I start throwing out ideas on how the quests could be improved.

 

As for the ones complaining about the quests causing them to over-level, I have indeed seen those complaints as well. However, it is to my understanding that those individuals are not playing on the upper difficulty levels (gold, platinum, etc). Perhaps I am mistaken, but it seems to me that the quest experience in the upper difficulties doesn't provide enough incentive to even bother with the quests. The quest item rewards are enticing, but at the moment, too many of the quest givers are bugged and not giving their full rewards .

 

And don't get me wrong, I am not intentionally trying to compare the game to Oblivion or any other pure RPGs. I am just saying that those games have been on the console market already, and when Sacred 2 hits the stores in March for the PS3/Xbucket, people will dive into it and use Oblivion and such as frames of reference. I think if they were to play the game as it is in its current state, I do not think they would be very thrilled with the quest rewards. They just do not seem to well... make you feel like your time was well spent.

 

That being said, everything else about the game.... oh I love it. I find it as a refreshing break from the tired Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest wannabe RPGs who try to take themselves seriously, but end up looking like everything else I've already played. Plus, I'm glad someone finally made a game with a playable evil character who is actually cool.

Edited February 11, 2009 by Cthulhu

[gogoblender 3,071]

Ctulhu and Katran, your first posts were amazing reads...thank you! Well...what I'll say is this... WOW is a little too good at knowing what makes us tick, and what keeps us at the comp. It's probably because it's SO good at what it does that I don't play it. I mean think about it...when something gets so good in your life, something you call a hobby or a game...it becomes a kind of alternate reality... and it begins to compete with my real life.

 

Job, forum, wiki, family... I'm not sure I would be good at managing this, specially as I get addicted to gaming so easily and quickly.

 

I'll say that I love Sacred 2 and have been waiting for it so long because I can put it away and it just waits till I go back. I can level easily enough on my own, and don't necessarily need a huge group of peeps like in the raids in WOW.

 

Let's call this balance. Because I perceive Sacred 2 as being such a balanced game, and it's easy for me to either lose myself in for hours and/or switch off, I love it.

 

 

gogo

[Llama8 8]

Edit: To specifically 'change' that formula and how it is applied to Sacred 2, or in general? If you mean for Sacred 2, I would like to think on answering that question. I think if I were to answer it right now, it would sound like something that would be unrealistic and too game wrecking.

 

As for the changing the formula in general, that's something else that I think will slowly "evolve", but never actually "go away".

 

In general, I think the "tired and worn out Everquest formula of having you do hundreds of quests and/or kill lots of monsters to level up" has been in existence since there were games with levels & XP requirements, so I wonder whether the (A)RPG genre has become so fixated on it that they don't think anything else exists (or works)...

*shrugs*

Granted, can't think of anything different.

[Schot 407]

I liked your thoughts on the comparison Cthulhu and Katran. I've never played WoW so it gave me a quick and easy understanding of how they differ. The reason I've never played it is pretty easy to say, heh. For fear I would lose myself in it! I'm sure it's an absolutely amazing game. Somehow I doubt it is as mysterious, or kooky which I love, as Sacred 2. Oh and I like the close bonds that seem to develop in a non mmo type game. The community is so closely connected, even if only a little bit for some people. Something tells me that it would not be the same in WoW.

 

As for those quests rewards... I wonder if anyone has begun documenting the quest rewards gotten when having Bargaining Mastery. Might be some interesting treasues to be found eh. ^^

[Cthulhu 0]

I liked your thoughts on the comparison Cthulhu and Katran. I've never played WoW so it gave me a quick and easy understanding of how they differ. The reason I've never played it is pretty easy to say, heh. For fear I would lose myself in it! I'm sure it's an absolutely amazing game. Somehow I doubt it is as mysterious, or kooky which I love, as Sacred 2. Oh and I like the close bonds that seem to develop in a non mmo type game. The community is so closely connected, even if only a little bit for some people. Something tells me that it would not be the same in WoW.

 

As for those quests rewards... I wonder if anyone has begun documenting the quest rewards gotten when having Bargaining Mastery. Might be some interesting treasues to be found eh. ^^

 

 

... Check out my post in the thread on bargaining.