Casting Speed - right click attacks, Attack Speed - left click attacks

[gogoblender 3,071]

This is something Schot came up with a few months ago while we were pondering the mysteries of Sacred 2's mechanics and the effect of bacon on cosmic rays.

 

So...to all the other Sacred 2 Mechanics lovers out there... does the statement makes sense...

 

Casting Speed - right click attacks, Attack Speed - left click attacks ...

 

Is this the truth?

 

 

gogo

 

p.s. we already figgered out the effect of fried bacon on cosmic rays

[Munera 1]

Hey! I found something interesting.

 

Execution speed depends on Aspect Lore, but those Combat Arts whose Aspect Lore is Tactics Lore, they get their speed by Weapon Lore, not Tactics Lore.

 

Yes, it seems that Attack Speed is only for attacks and Casting Speed is only for spells (magical Combat Arts). However, Combat Arts based on weapons get benefits from both!

Edited February 21, 2010 by Munera

[gogoblender 3,071]

However, Combat Arts based on weapons get benefits from both!

 

 

Ahhh, VERY interesting this... but what do you mean exactly? For example, yes... I agree that execution speed (as coming from lores) will increase speed of the right click attacks "going off".... and I've read in places that weapon based Combat Art's are modded by Casting Speed and Lores... but now you are saying that a weapon based Combat Art is governed by BOTH lore+Casting Speed AND... Attack Speed ?

 

Do you have an example:

 

 

gogo

[Munera 1]

Look, I have a dual Shadow Warrior (my new EU lobby Shadow Warrior ). He has 117% attack speed thanks to Dual weild, and I have Lucreti's Arms that give me Casting Speed 6%, so my execution Speed for all weapon based combat arts (well, let's say those Combat Art whose Aspect Lore is Tactics Lore) is 124% (demonic blow, belligerant vault, ruinous onslaught...) I emphasize that because Belligerant Vault isn't a combat art based on weapons, it's a spell indeed, but its aspect focus is tactics, so it gets speed from dual weild just as a normal attack does.

[nomad13 2]

I was pondering on socketing some +casting speed to help my Frenzied Rampage speed, I still have to try it. I dont use a weapon lore because I use Dual Wield and that increases speed on both weapons.

[Spunky 16]

Dual Wield is also a kind of weapon lore, and you still gain the +casting speed from it.

[Schot 407]

Ah, now this is interesting. Great info on the unique way that the Shadow Warrior can increase his execution speed. I just looked at tactics lore and then compared to Aspect Lore. If my guess is right then Tactics Lore actually has an unlisted Execution Speed, +% bonus that is only applied to the Shadow Warrior. With that in mind should we should add a row for Execution Speed, +%, like Aspect Lore has, with a stipulation that it only applies to the Shadow Warrior. Cool.

 

P.s.

I'd wager that the bonus per level would be the same...

[Spunky 16]

Sure about this casting speed/execution speed from Tactics Lore?

 

For me that sounds weird as I've played Shadow Warrior's since the beginning and never noticed any boost from it.

Edited February 21, 2010 by Spunky

[Schot 407]

Oops, just tried with tactics and no change. So then what I said but Weapon Lore instead of Tactics Lore, haha.

[Munera 1]

Ah, now this is interesting. Great info on the unique way that the Shadow Warrior can increase his execution speed. I just looked at tactics lore and then compared to Aspect Lore. If my guess is right then Tactics Lore actually has an unlisted Execution Speed, +% bonus that is only applied to the Shadow Warrior. With that in mind should we should add a row for Execution Speed, +%, like Aspect Lore has, with a stipulation that it only applies to the Shadow Warrior. Cool.

 

P.s.

I'd wager that the bonus per level would be the same...

 

I think you're misunderstanding me. Think a little. Tactics Lore Aspects don't get their speed increased from Tactics Lore, but from Weapon Lore. If you do a belligerant vault weilding a sword (and you have sword weapons skill) it will be faster than if you do it with an axe. Try it yourself. Active your grim resillience weilding your weapons and then weilding no weapons and you'll see the speed difference.

 

EDIT:

Oops, just tried with tactics and no change. So then what I said but Weapon Lore instead of Tactics Lore, haha.

that's it

Edited February 21, 2010 by Munera

[Spunky 16]

Hehe, thought so

[Munera 1]

the thing is that those special Combat Arts get benefits from Casting Speed, but there isn't a skill that provides Casting Speed for those, so we can only increase it via item modifiers.

Edited February 21, 2010 by Munera

[Spunky 16]

I'm a bit lost here, which special combat arts?

[Schot 407]

the thing is that those special Combat Arts get benefits from Casting Speed, but there isn't a skill that provides Casting Speed for those, so we can only increase it via item modifiers.

 

I'm a bit lost here, which special combat arts?

 

 

Ah, starting to make sense. Any combat art for which there is an Aspect Lore will not have it's execution speed affected by a Weapon Skill. Hence their Aspect Lore will increase their execution speeds and not a Weapon Skill.

 

The Shadow Warrior for example:

 

Death Warrior - Execution Speed from any of the available Weapon Skills.

Malevolent Champion - Execution Speed from any of the available Weapon Skills.

Astral Lord - Execution Speed from Astral Lord Lore

[locolagarto 15]

one more vote here for weapons lore adds both attack speed and cast speed to weapon attacks that have only tactics and no aspect lore. left clk is attack speed and right click is cast(execution) speed.

 

A great test and or example is the weaponless KungFu build. with no benefits from a weapon lore you have to socket cast speed and attack speed to get any help with attack Combat Arts

[gogoblender 3,071]

with no benefits from a weapon lore you have to socket cast speed and attack speed to get any help with attack Combat Arts

 

 

Interesting. One of those is an item modifier and the other is a skill modder.

 

Are you sure you are socketing Attack Speed to increase the right click Execution speed for a Combat art? You have seen execution speed go up in your stats for your toon after you socket Attack Speed?

 

 

gogo

[Munera 1]

Oh... then Attack Speed has no effect on Combat arts and Weapon Lore gives a hidden Casting Speed bonus?

[locolagarto 15]

with no benefits from a weapon lore you have to socket cast speed and attack speed to get any help with attack Combat Arts

 

 

Interesting. One of those is an item modifier and the other is a skill modder.

 

Are you sure you are socketing Attack Speed to increase the right click Execution speed for a Combat art? You have seen execution speed go up in your stats for your toon after you socket Attack Speed?

 

 

gogo

 

 

Ooops! Nope, attack speed is only for left click only. But I socketed both attack and cast in early levels until RPH came online to help with the Combat Arts . then just cast speed to get the right clicks to animate faster and take advantage of the RPH.

[Schot 407]

Oh... then Attack Speed has no effect on Combat arts and Weapon Lore gives a hidden Casting Speed bonus?

 

I believe so. It seems to be a hidden value... Or Ascaron didn't get around to adding that to the tooltips, heh. Looks like the Weapon Skills need an additional note and perhaps an added table row.

 

Nicely done all!

[locolagarto 15]

Oh... then Attack Speed has no effect on Combat arts and Weapon Lore gives a hidden Casting Speed bonus?

 

I believe so. It seems to be a hidden value... Or Ascaron didn't get around to adding that to the tooltips, heh.

 

 

I thought it did say in the tool tip, or maybe I just compared the attack speed in tool tip to execution speed on Combat Art tool tip and put the connection together....

[Spunky 16]

So to conclude here, weapon based Combat Art's get their execution speed from weapon lores, and spell related Combat Art's from aspect lores.

 

And also +casting speed from gear affect weapons and spells Combat Art's.

[Munera 1]

No, it's not weapon based combat arts, but Combat Arts whose Aspect Lore is Tactics Lore. Belligerant Vault isn't a weapon based combat art, and it receives speed from Weapon Lore, and Magic Coup (probably, don't know) mayhave both its damage and execution speed modified by Delphic Arcania Lore, but neither Tactics nor Weapon Lore and it's still a weapon based combat art. Tell me if I'm wrong.

[Schot 407]

Ah, I could see how that connection would be made. Attack speed is meant for left click speeds only but in the case of a Combat Art that doesn't have an Aspect Lore we could interpret the Attack Speed in the tooltip as also being execution speed. Provided the values are the same.

 

EDIT:

 

And speaking of differing speed values... It looks as though the increase per level in speed is the same on both the Aspect Lore table and the Weapon Skill table.

[Spunky 16]

Ok then, let's take it this way: aspects that receives mod points from Tactics Lore get's their execution speed from the weapon lore no matter if it's weapon related or spell related.

 

True?

Edited February 21, 2010 by Spunky

[Munera 1]

I think it's as you said, woody.

 

Hey!

 

Checked something very interested. The mod Attack Speed only increases the speed of the attacks, but not the execution speed of combat arts. Another thing to consider is that the weapon penalty Attack Speed -% also affects execution speed of combat arts. At least for those whose Aspect Lore is Tactis. I'll check if it also affects some other Combat Arts