Runes and Max Combat Art Level - Changes in Ice & Blood

[gogoblender 3,070]

Still you can socket niobium arts to level 1 char.

 

lol, wasn't going to say anything until I got my copies...but I think that critical on smith arts has... *gets ready to duck tomatoes* been nerfed as well for Spell casters?

 

*ducks*

 

 

gogo

 

p.s We'll have to get confirmation from Chrona on this to see if it's true...but it looks like the devs put a serious hamper on all the tricks we were all using for our "cheat" builds

 

Well, in a way I'm glad, I was finding the game to be way to easy. Even my Inquisitor at low levels was getting to be a bore with all the tricks we could run with like skills rings, niob smith arts.. lots more stuff .

 

This is a good wake up for me, and I'm glad to have the playing field leveled. There's going to be a lot of re-learning for me...but I'm the kind of person that loves the journey more than anything else in life.

[Knuckles 904]

This is a good wake up for me, and I'm glad to have the playing field leveled.

 

Leveled:) they changed half the rules and put in astro turf lol

 

I don't mind re-balancing, nerfing here, a boost there. But the rune cap really bugs me (no pun intended if it is a bug) It radically affects every build I have. And that is 100's of hours invested. And if it bothers me, and I'm a build tinkerer anyways, then I think the more dedicated grinders must be pulling out their hair.

 

They fundamentally changed how just about every build works with this. If I had 5 or more 150+ toons I'd be pretty upset. I love Sacred and love all the developers, but having this in place and no known support for patches has convinced me not to get the add-on. I was going to get it just to support Ascaron but since they no longer exist, most of my reasoning to buy has vanished.

 

I bet the quest enemy bug wasn't fixed either....lost more toons to that than all the other reasons for deaths combined. I'm sure Ice and Blood will hold appeal for many people and I'm not trying to bash the game...for me, there are just too many things wrong and too many questions unanswered to justify buying the expansion

[gogoblender 3,070]

Yes, the rune nerf is a huge blow to a lot of my builds as well. So many of my builds were reliant upon the engorgement of hundreds of runes...

 

 

I'm wondering how I'm going to over come this. I think Chrona posted that he's using gear?

 

Is he socketing Plus to all Combat Arts in booster slots to get the Oomph back into his builds?

 

 

gogo

[Dobri 55]

In my eyes, the proper course of action would be to nerf the overpowered builds and support the underpowered. That would have brought a balance in this game. Making a global nerf was a very, very bad idea. It made the overpowered builds slightly weaker (but I can still see the demi-god status with a lot of them), the mediocre builds a bit of a challenge and the tough and unorthodox builds a true hell on Earth. Now, pray tell, who will willingly play a wickedly underpowered build unless he/she feels really masochistic?

[gogoblender 3,070]

I'm as anxious as others to see how the new builds will come out and be played, Dobri. There's going to be a lot of imagination and experiments fueling this game's future. I see a tremendous amount of work done with obscure item mods that were considered to be useless before, and am ready to be delighted. Chrona has been documenting his progress with his changes, has already specced out some of the new "god builds" and has summarized items that people were throwing away, now to find renewed life in this game.

 

As I posted up above, this happened before with Underworld a few years ago.

 

We lost all our builds, but came out on top.

 

This forum got built, we met all you guys, the community has grown, and it's one I'm very very proud of, as I think many of it's members are. And... the wiki was born.

 

Not a bad road, eh?

 

 

gogo

[Antitrust 32]

For some reason I suspect that there was an overflow or a bug discovered, which led to this "nerf".

 

Or you finally got a way to respec runes that is actually possible to implement in the current game engine.

[Dobri 55]

Gogo, the good question here is: "how many new builds we can have when the skills are the same?"

 

Builds were based on simple things:

 

Defense:

damage mitigation

chance to block

armor rating (as high as it can get)

reflection

evasion

 

Offense:

deathblow

all skills

all ca

+ damage

runes eaten

 

I doubt nerfing some of these will change the current (popular) builds a lot

Edited September 4, 2009 by Dobri

[gogoblender 3,070]

I have every confidence in the ingenuity and skill of the niob-level players. I know people will find a way to thrive in the new environment, and sure, there will be tough times while things are worked out. But I know it is going to be very exciting!

 

 

These are good words. The process of change is always a tough one. If it weren't tough, there wouldn't have been any real value in what we were doing before.

 

I'm looking forward to as much creativity with the new builds as there were with the old

 

Chrona has already specced out God Builds in Niob...and there will be many, many more!

 

 

gogo

[Katran 0]

Gogo you keep saying new builds but you know that all builds have already been done. There wont be new builds apart from builds for the DM but he doesnt count since he is new altogether. And its not about lack of ideas its because all has been done. It will be the old stuff just getting killed more and being harder to play.

[gogoblender 3,070]

Gogo you keep saying new builds but you know that all builds have already been done.

 

Are you sure about that?

 

Schot hasn't posted his HE build yet, it's supposed to be a killer ^^ (we have to get him to stop making maps for us )

 

I've never posted my pure magic Dryad... I've never seen anyone yet put out a Twisted Torment build with it as primary attack... And how about the ranged SW...has anyone taken one to Niobium and posted it's build yet?

 

There's lots more to uncover I think. And there hasn't been a pure MF build either? I think Schot could be working on that as well?

 

We have collected nowhere near as many builds yet with Sacred 2 as with original Sacred. I want to see them all. Bring them on we say!

 

 

gogo

[Katran 0]

No offense but there is one thing to say a guide about something hasnt been posted and hasnt been played.

As I said there is only so many things you can do. You can force some things with gear but limiting gear makes it harder to push toons.

And if all the topics are checked the people that complain in them are not any players they are players that have played tons of hours in the game many have even broken the game down to a math so most of the things that are said make sense.

[gogoblender 3,070]

No offense but there is one thing to say a guide about something hasnt been posted and hasnt been played.

 

I'm still waiting for builds to get made with the new add-on. I'm looking forward to seeing how god builds get made in this final installation. We'll have to see which builds actually "hold water" with the add-on and which will have to be scrapped.

 

Chrona is saying it's fun, I'm thinking it will be, and looking forward to it.

 

With the choice of regen systems with addon, I want to see how Dryad Combat Arts work with one overall timer for the new Dryad...hopefully she'll come out okay ^^

 

gogo

[Zonc1 0]

Sure someone could do builds like "throwing daggers SW caster" or "unarmed Inqusitor ninja" and take them from 1 to 200. I guess it is possible, but I'm expecting certain level of effectiveness from char that I play. All best builds have been tried out a long time ago.

[gogoblender 3,070]

I'm expecting certain level of effectiveness from char that I play.

 

All best builds have been tried out a long time ago.

 

 

I require a certain level of effectiveness as well, but this is highly subjective, unique and completely dependent on build intent. This game's a sandbox, there's no real accountability to DPS IMO. Even throwing out the concept of a "best build" is very vague and highly subjective.

 

Exotic builds abound, there creators are experts with game mechanics. When people get bored with killing fastest (and that happens awfully fast) where do we go next...another game?

 

It's those builds that become interesting, while the cookie cutter fastest kill possible remain as meat and bread. It's the exotic builds that will show finesses, art and creativity.

 

 

gogo

[Katran 0]

For holding water all builds will still be valid. They will be good for the original game. If you ask me they will still work in the add on just that they will be harder to play. Even as it stands I think very few people had a ton of high level +skills and +CA hell I got my toon to 200 with only one +25 amulets never have seen anything other then that one that high. Highest thing I have used was 18 apart from that one.

The hole point is that people are screaming about is that it limits there creativity. They cant do strange things because there +skills support will be limited.

To make things harder they needed to add more damage HP and armor on monsters. Instead of giving the cobolts a bigger sword they chose to give us sticks. If you send a wrestler after the cobolt he will still kick his behind but it will be hard if you send barbie well this time around she will get her behind kicked.

 

Oh and exotic builds have creativity and finesses, art and creativity. What do cookie cutters have then.

In all respect the cookie cutter is the ultimate toon in creativity because thats what it got to become a cookie cutter in the first place. Remember no toon is born cookie cutter.

[wintermane 0]

I can think of two new builds.. a pure caster seraphim with ancient magic and a pure caster Inquisitor with ancient magic.

[Dobri 55]

I agree. In a way, ancient magic compensates for the lack of deathblow... provided you spend a considerable amount of skill points to make it work. The current builds will not have the luxury of picking it up because they have used up all their skill picks. At least one can start looking and planning for the new builds. I'm one of these people, because I don't want the pure caster inquisitor build to die.

 

Now this will be a challenge.

[Chrona 82]

Another new feature: you can shoot with the staffs no need in rangecomabt, only MagicStaffs

 

I'll make another totemdryad->casting totemn and shoot

[chattius 2,527]

With resorting equipment, using new weapons (axe with x% life leech) to buffer my lower hp regeneration from lower GI BUFF on my elf, I am close to only magic coup again with already the same damage. So my melee elf is axe again, funny.

And I needed 30 minutes to do it, well the axe was found by my daughter with her character, but still its doable.

 

Both elves from my daughters proved to be still playable in NIOB, new areas.

The Character of my oldest daughter: A mainly melee/arcane PvP-build for youth club duells, characters restored after each duell:

bargaining, arcane lore/focus, inferno focus, storm focus, concentration, armour lore, shield lore, alchemy, ancient magic

 

And the shield-maid (nick name: valkyrie from the land of ice and fire, because of both elemetal foci) from my second daughter, starting melee and being able to play full ice, or full melee in high levels.

arcane lore/focus, storm lore/focus, inferno focus, armour, shield, ancient magic , concentration, sword lore

 

Both builds were started before the AddOn. The PVP got both skins to adapt to different players classes, and used alchemy because of this reason too.

The Shield Maid got both skins, because fire skin is better in melee, while crystall better if playing an ice elf.

 

So it was not planed that the now more frequent CA users can be countered by changing the skins. But noticing the new danger it is an option. Combat disciplin would have been better for optimizing the damage, but I wanted by Kids to be able to adapt to changing situations. Sometime I even ask them if they can play Platinum or begin NIOB without buffs, and stuff like this.

 

I already found a unique breast armour with +x% intelligence for the dragon mage, and my playtime is 11 hours only total in the AddOn. So there may be more hidden new stuff, like direct damage modifier on weapons.

 

Starting the Dragon mage I didn't modify my runes for physical armour, but for stun, arrow block and CA block. Because CA-Block/Reflect seems to be very useful now.

 

And enemies with life leech attacks are now a factor to calculate with.

Edited September 4, 2009 by chattius

[Dobri 55]

I quite like that idea. It will support the classes who use stationary DPS CAs, like the totem dryad and the uncloaked astral SW with skeletal Fortification and add value to those builds, since the staffs generally come with good attributes to support caster builds. Now that's worth the try

 

The only thing I can't help but wonder is how the TG going. Did anyone make a decent TG in Ice and Blood, Chrona? Looking at the changes, the only playable TG should be either pure devout, or devout/fusion oriented. Unless they improved the CA damage of Source Warden, that tree would seem completely useless now - no ancient magic to back it up and no deathblow to support it.

[Chrona 82]

Slevin starts a pure source warden build(with blacksmith) with the addon (he have a level 200 source warden TG)

 

level 100 in 20 hours

http://forum.sacred-game.com/showpost.php?...;postcount=1574

 

I'll ask him, maybe he can post here a small review

[ka243 3]

I'm 100% sure this is a bug... If it were not a bug it would have been listed in the change notes/patch notes which very clearly it was not.

Edited September 4, 2009 by gogoblender
removed comments

[gogoblender 3,070]

Another new feature: you can shoot with the staffs no need in rangecombat, only MagicStaffs

 

I'll make another totemdryad->casting totemn and shoot

 

 

Great new idea for a build! I'm just curious... would the firing rate with picking just staves be as fast as if we had picked ranged as well?

 

 

gogo

[chattius 2,527]

Regeneration per Hit is said to be working in the AddOn. So you should be able to use weapon hits to recharge high power stationary Combat Arts

 

Or, what I am planing to try:

Rescue my Melee elf, so a hit recharges her magic coup right again

if regeneration per hit can recharge the LONG regeneration horse-Combat Arts

if regeneration per hit from alchemy trophy will allow a dragon berserker playstyle with nearly permanent right click attacks

 

Somehow I had luck with my intuitive dragon mage build, I can test out a lot in a single build, and its unique, I know noone else who did riding on a dragon mage.

[Chrona 82]

Great new idea for a build! I'm just curious... would the firing rate with picking just staves be as fast as if we had picked ranged as well?

 

 

gogo

 

No, its the same like melee with staff

 

Inquisitor with dw and staff don't fire both staffs at the same time